In PUA literature there the idea that making a girl horny while at a club, asking her for her phone number and then calling a day later to make a date is not the way to go.
You don’t say? :nicholascage:
Having the girl in a state of being attracted, comfortable and connected is supposed to be more conductive to getting a date than the girl feeling horny.
Ah. If that’s what you mean by “being attracted” (myself, I’d usually call that “liking”), then I think that there are tons of things that have a waaaay larger effect than anything one could learn easily learn by formal dance classes but not otherwise, though it depends on the person (for example, certain people seem to be attracted to intelligence, others repelled).
I think you are ‘in your head’,
That much I do usually agree, though it varies on whether I’m sleep-deprived, whether I’ve been drinking, how much and what I’ve been reading lately, and other factors. (In particular, I think I’m much less “in my head” when I’m with people I’m at ease with, which is a proper superset of the people I’m willing to date long-term.)
You are probably the kind of person who thinks that they have a body instead of who thinks that they are their body. You probably think that you are your brain and the rest is just there to serve your brain.
FWIW, I’m the kind of person who thinks that what “I” means depends on the context, so whether I am my body or my brain isn’t even a well-defined question (both literally and metaphorically).
On the other hand I do think that your reluctance to wear a free-hug sign is purely based on a irrational fear of physical contact. Wearing the sign is the rational thing to do.
Even taking in account status signalling? (A way to make that moot would be to wear such a sign somewhere I don’t expect anyone I know, or anyone who knows anyone I know and is likely to talk about that, to see me.)
I don’t know the company that you keep. Most people I personally care about impressing wouldn’t see it as low status.
If someone tells me: “I read about this free hug thing and then I tried it out”, what does that tell me about the person? He’s signalling that his adventurous and willing to do things that are a bit outside of the social norm that produce good feelings for other people.
Doing creepy pickup approaches can be a low status signal if people you know get wind of it. I don’t see that problem with running around with a free hug sign.
How about you ask one of your female friends whether they would think less or more of someone who did the “free hug” thing you read about on the internet? Does she thinks it’s cool?
I mean what do you do for signaling high-status? Playing golf?
If someone tells me: “I read about this free hug thing and then I tried it out”, what does that tell me about the person? He’s signalling that his adventurous and willing to do things that are a bit outside of the social norm that produce good feelings for other people.
I seem to have a vague recollection of someone in one of my social groups watching a video (or something) of some guy doing the free hugs thing, and commenting something to the effect that (loosely paraphrasing) he must be a loser pathetically looking for pretexts to convince girls to hug him who otherwise wouldn’t; and indeed, very few people seemed eager to hug him. (I can’t remember more details about that.) Looking back at all the times I remember people wearing such signs, they were almost always males, usually not terribly attractive, and often in religious or political associations; none of these sounds high-status to me, if by “status” we mean social power rather than structural power. And the only times they seemed to be received well was during New Year’s/carnival/similar celebrations, where ISTM it’s also socially acceptable to ask random people for hugs who are not wearing free-hug signs.
Doing creepy pickup approaches can be a low status signal if people you know get wind of it.
I dunno; extrapolating from the closest things to that that did happen to me, they would either applaud my boldness or excuse me because creeping each other out is something people (especially when drunk) sometimes do by accident and it doesn’t mean they are evil. Unless you have in mind values of “creepy” sufficient for the bouncers to kick me out of the club, but even then IME people I already know will react with sympathy, not disgust.
How about you ask one of your female friends whether they would think less or more of someone who did the “free hug” thing you read about on the internet? Does she thinks it’s cool?
The last time I mentioned to a female friend something about me sometimes getting anxious when around people and trying to overcome that, she was like ‘what the hell are you talking about, you’re one of the most laid-back people I know’ (incidentally, the same person said something similar when I said I wasn’t that good at dancing and was trying to get better at it). You know, people usually are reluctant to criticize their friends, and while I try to indicate that I operate under Crocker’s rules that often only goes so far. (I know that’s not exactly what you suggested me to ask, but I’m under the impression that in such contexts “someone” would be so obvious an euphemism that it would defeat the point.)
I mean what do you do for signaling high-status?
Mostly, stuff like singing, dancing (but not paying people money to do that, except occasionally for night club cover charges), drinking a lot but still functioning enough for stuff like this, dressing extravagantly (but not particularly expensively), telling people about my travels abroad, or posting witticisms and photos on Facebook. Why?
Playing golf?
Hell no. That sounds expensive, posh, and not terribly fun. And not the kind of thing I’d likely be good at. :-)
I seem to have a vague recollection of someone in one of my social groups watching a video (or something) of some guy doing the free hugs thing, and commenting something to the effect that (loosely paraphrasing) he must be a loser pathetically looking for pretexts to convince girls to hug him who otherwise wouldn’t; and indeed, very few people seemed eager to hug him. (I can’t remember more details about that.) Looking back at all the times I remember people wearing such signs, they were almost always males, usually not terribly attractive, and often in religious or political associations; none of these sounds high-status to me, if by “status” we mean social power rather than structural power. And the only times they seemed to be received well was during New Year’s/carnival/similar celebrations, where ISTM it’s also socially acceptable to ask random people for hugs who are not wearing free-hug signs.
“Free hugs” signs are also a fairly common feature at anime conventions. Many of the people I’ve seen with them have been cute girls.
“Free hugs” signs are also a fairly common feature at anime conventions.
Never been to one of those, but I guess that I would feel much less out-of-place wearing such a sign at an anime convention (conditional on me not feeling out-of-place at the convention without the sign) than in a street downtown. (Though now that I try to think of it more in near mode, even the latter would depend on the time of the day and my blood alcohol content. Hmmm.)
I seem to have a vague recollection of someone in one of my social groups watching a video (or something) of some guy doing the free hugs thing, and commenting something to the effect that (loosely paraphrasing) he must be a loser pathetically looking for pretexts to convince girls to hug him who otherwise wouldn’t; and indeed, very few people seemed eager to hug him.
“He” is the operating word. The fox and the sour grapes.
I dunno; extrapolating from the closest things to that that did happen to me, they would either applaud my boldness or excuse me because creeping each other out is something people (especially when drunk) sometimes do by accident and it doesn’t mean they are evil.
I’m not saying that everyone who does PUA is creepy but there are people who persue it in a way that alinates friends. I can understand why someone might not want to be seen by people he knows when he’s doing random cold approaches on the street.
Mostly, stuff like singing, dancing (but not paying people money to do that, except occasionally for night club cover charges)
I think that in both domains that you will get more status over the long term if you invest in professional training which costs money to build your skills.
I think you will get more status over the long-term by building your skills as effectively as possible than by self handicapping.
“He” is the operating word. The fox and the sour grapes.
I think that the person who commented about him was female, though I don’t remember for sure.
I can understand why someone might not want to be seen by people he knows when he’s doing random cold approaches on the street.
Why not? IME wingmen provide social proof. (Though there are cultural differences from place to place—for example, I would do that in the town where I study now but not where I grew up, as most of the population of the latter respond to random cold approaches on the street by frowning at you then looking away.)
I think that in both domains that you will get more status over the long term if you invest in professional training which costs money to build your skills.
Yes, but 1) I’m already 26, so I dunno how much sense it still makes to invest in “the long term” in this kind of things, and 2) the difference would be only noticed by people who are themselves sufficiently high-status in those domains (I’ve already had several people who asked me where I took singing classes and seemed surprised where I told them that I didn’t), so I’m not sure the game is worth the candle given that I’m not looking for a professional career in singing. (I might try to take singing and/or dancing classes next year if I’m not as strapped for time as now, but it’s not a priority.)
You don’t say? :nicholascage:
Ah. If that’s what you mean by “being attracted” (myself, I’d usually call that “liking”), then I think that there are tons of things that have a waaaay larger effect than anything one could learn easily learn by formal dance classes but not otherwise, though it depends on the person (for example, certain people seem to be attracted to intelligence, others repelled).
That much I do usually agree, though it varies on whether I’m sleep-deprived, whether I’ve been drinking, how much and what I’ve been reading lately, and other factors. (In particular, I think I’m much less “in my head” when I’m with people I’m at ease with, which is a proper superset of the people I’m willing to date long-term.)
FWIW, I’m the kind of person who thinks that what “I” means depends on the context, so whether I am my body or my brain isn’t even a well-defined question (both literally and metaphorically).
Even taking in account status signalling? (A way to make that moot would be to wear such a sign somewhere I don’t expect anyone I know, or anyone who knows anyone I know and is likely to talk about that, to see me.)
I don’t know the company that you keep. Most people I personally care about impressing wouldn’t see it as low status.
If someone tells me: “I read about this free hug thing and then I tried it out”, what does that tell me about the person? He’s signalling that his adventurous and willing to do things that are a bit outside of the social norm that produce good feelings for other people.
Doing creepy pickup approaches can be a low status signal if people you know get wind of it. I don’t see that problem with running around with a free hug sign.
How about you ask one of your female friends whether they would think less or more of someone who did the “free hug” thing you read about on the internet? Does she thinks it’s cool?
I mean what do you do for signaling high-status? Playing golf?
I seem to have a vague recollection of someone in one of my social groups watching a video (or something) of some guy doing the free hugs thing, and commenting something to the effect that (loosely paraphrasing) he must be a loser pathetically looking for pretexts to convince girls to hug him who otherwise wouldn’t; and indeed, very few people seemed eager to hug him. (I can’t remember more details about that.) Looking back at all the times I remember people wearing such signs, they were almost always males, usually not terribly attractive, and often in religious or political associations; none of these sounds high-status to me, if by “status” we mean social power rather than structural power. And the only times they seemed to be received well was during New Year’s/carnival/similar celebrations, where ISTM it’s also socially acceptable to ask random people for hugs who are not wearing free-hug signs.
I dunno; extrapolating from the closest things to that that did happen to me, they would either applaud my boldness or excuse me because creeping each other out is something people (especially when drunk) sometimes do by accident and it doesn’t mean they are evil. Unless you have in mind values of “creepy” sufficient for the bouncers to kick me out of the club, but even then IME people I already know will react with sympathy, not disgust.
The last time I mentioned to a female friend something about me sometimes getting anxious when around people and trying to overcome that, she was like ‘what the hell are you talking about, you’re one of the most laid-back people I know’ (incidentally, the same person said something similar when I said I wasn’t that good at dancing and was trying to get better at it). You know, people usually are reluctant to criticize their friends, and while I try to indicate that I operate under Crocker’s rules that often only goes so far. (I know that’s not exactly what you suggested me to ask, but I’m under the impression that in such contexts “someone” would be so obvious an euphemism that it would defeat the point.)
Mostly, stuff like singing, dancing (but not paying people money to do that, except occasionally for night club cover charges), drinking a lot but still functioning enough for stuff like this, dressing extravagantly (but not particularly expensively), telling people about my travels abroad, or posting witticisms and photos on Facebook. Why?
Hell no. That sounds expensive, posh, and not terribly fun. And not the kind of thing I’d likely be good at. :-)
“Free hugs” signs are also a fairly common feature at anime conventions. Many of the people I’ve seen with them have been cute girls.
Never been to one of those, but I guess that I would feel much less out-of-place wearing such a sign at an anime convention (conditional on me not feeling out-of-place at the convention without the sign) than in a street downtown. (Though now that I try to think of it more in near mode, even the latter would depend on the time of the day and my blood alcohol content. Hmmm.)
“He” is the operating word. The fox and the sour grapes.
I’m not saying that everyone who does PUA is creepy but there are people who persue it in a way that alinates friends. I can understand why someone might not want to be seen by people he knows when he’s doing random cold approaches on the street.
I think that in both domains that you will get more status over the long term if you invest in professional training which costs money to build your skills.
I think you will get more status over the long-term by building your skills as effectively as possible than by self handicapping.
I think that the person who commented about him was female, though I don’t remember for sure.
Why not? IME wingmen provide social proof. (Though there are cultural differences from place to place—for example, I would do that in the town where I study now but not where I grew up, as most of the population of the latter respond to random cold approaches on the street by frowning at you then looking away.)
Yes, but 1) I’m already 26, so I dunno how much sense it still makes to invest in “the long term” in this kind of things, and 2) the difference would be only noticed by people who are themselves sufficiently high-status in those domains (I’ve already had several people who asked me where I took singing classes and seemed surprised where I told them that I didn’t), so I’m not sure the game is worth the candle given that I’m not looking for a professional career in singing. (I might try to take singing and/or dancing classes next year if I’m not as strapped for time as now, but it’s not a priority.)