Consider how an heroin addict will find some way or the other to get heroin, which goes to show that “want” is very strongly linked to getting things done.
So given how you described things, let’s say you (try to) do nothing. Inevitably you will feel the discomfort and urge to work, or a discomfort/in a form of cynicism/awkwardness. This should be “processed” to come to concrete practical reasons why you do X, rather than because you should. I am trying to suggest a method to get at this process.
Hmm. I don’t think I’m disputing the definition of “want”, and in fact am saying I procrastinate on stuff that I do actually for real want to do, but am scared of or uncertain about.
Like, as a prototypical example, imagine a 14 year old who wants to ask their crush out. They really do want this! But often, they lose their nerve and put it off until tomorrow. I don’t think this has much to do with the teen failing to be sufficiently default in their action, and more to do with them being afraid!
Introspecting, much more of my actual procrastination feels like this case than a case where I don’t really want the thing after all.
Interesting example—and this will apply for all dilemmas (a specific want isn’t clear) - such as leaving a job/marriage.
I feel an aspect there could be that of the “social default”. The 14 year old both a) wants to ask out their crush; b) maintain their social standing—and has lots of variables surrounding both. Empathizing with that person—if they scour to find their internal wants, they can realize they just really want peace and asking out the crush isn’t worth it, or that they just want fulfillment and apart from an amorphous blob of fear/social rejection/death, they should ask out their crush.
The crux of my argument is, fear is a negative desire, a positive desire stronger than that (jumping in front of the bullet for a loved one) will still dominate. Dilemmas are situations where a single desire may not dominate, so maybe a discovery of priorities are in order.
The devil is in the details here. The 14 year old wants to date their crush. Maybe even to know if they should move on. The 14 year old wants to avoid a situation where their crush laughs in their face, loudly announcing to the school that they thought they had a chance. If you can guarantee that they get laughed at, and ask them if they want to ask their crush out still, it’s going to be an easy “No thanks”.
But it’s hard to know, in general. Asking means maybe getting what you want, and maybe getting what you don’t want. And therefore you’ll feel drawn towards asking, but also hesitate in fear of what could go wrong. It’s not that you simultaneously “want to ask” and “want to not ask”, or “want to ask” and “fear asking”. It’s that you want to ask [and have it go well] and want to not ask [and have it go poorly]. When you fill in the missing details, the picture gets clearer.
The difficulty in making these decisions is in knowing whether it’s worth the risk—and knowing that it’s not worth learning more about the risk before committing. Once you can say “I want to ask and maybe get laughed at”—which again, is the reality of what “asking” means—then you’ve actually decided whether you want the uncertain outcome of asking. It’s at that point that you can accurately say that you want to ask out your crush, without the hidden “[and have it go well]” qualification.
”Wanting to maybe get laughed at” is a bizarre feeling, because we’re so used to trying to get the good without risking the bad (and for good reason!), but it’s a completely real experience, and a valuable one when the uncertainty is irreducible. The “fear” starts to feel more like “excitement”, and all of a sudden you’re more prepared to smile while being laughed at, because it no longer means you shouldn’t have asked.
I don’t think “do more default” alone is enough to get people there very often, but “don’t try so much to force yourself to do things you’re afraid of” does threaten to take those things that you want, and that does increase the pressure to want the scary things. And doing things that scare you is a lot more fun when you actually want the scary too.
I like your suggestion, gives me the same vibes as the adage of flipping a coin for a difficult decision because you will know what you subconsciously want when the coin’s in the air. Maybe I should have written a longer article instead of slightly aiming for aesthetics—but I will argue that all of such insights—eventually converge to all actions feeling default.
You seem to be playing this game where you redefine “want”, and then use it to prove that people actually don’t want things (according to your non-standard definition).
I want a glass of water/I want to write this comment/I want to listen to a song/I don’t want to solve global peace, but I want global peace to be solved.
I’m not addicted to heroin, but I am addicted to other stuff, and I often wouldn’t call it “wanting” the stuff, but “having an urge”. Like doomscrolling. It would be a stretch to say (in ordinary language) I want to doomscroll. I don’t want to doomscroll but I have an urge to doomscroll.
Maybe the want comes from the cortex, while the urge comes from the cerebellum. Or the want comes from the superego, while the urge comes from the id. Though I agree that at other times it doesn’t feel necessary to talk of urges. I distinguished two different explanations here. One with urges vs wants, one with “want” vs “want to want”. Though you already touched on the latter.
> rather than simply not really wanting the thing
Consider how an heroin addict will find some way or the other to get heroin, which goes to show that “want” is very strongly linked to getting things done.
So given how you described things, let’s say you (try to) do nothing. Inevitably you will feel the discomfort and urge to work, or a discomfort/in a form of cynicism/awkwardness. This should be “processed” to come to concrete practical reasons why you do X, rather than because you should. I am trying to suggest a method to get at this process.
Hmm. I don’t think I’m disputing the definition of “want”, and in fact am saying I procrastinate on stuff that I do actually for real want to do, but am scared of or uncertain about.
Like, as a prototypical example, imagine a 14 year old who wants to ask their crush out. They really do want this! But often, they lose their nerve and put it off until tomorrow. I don’t think this has much to do with the teen failing to be sufficiently default in their action, and more to do with them being afraid!
Introspecting, much more of my actual procrastination feels like this case than a case where I don’t really want the thing after all.
Interesting example—and this will apply for all dilemmas (a specific want isn’t clear) - such as leaving a job/marriage.
I feel an aspect there could be that of the “social default”. The 14 year old both a) wants to ask out their crush; b) maintain their social standing—and has lots of variables surrounding both. Empathizing with that person—if they scour to find their internal wants, they can realize they just really want peace and asking out the crush isn’t worth it, or that they just want fulfillment and apart from an amorphous blob of fear/social rejection/death, they should ask out their crush.
The crux of my argument is, fear is a negative desire, a positive desire stronger than that (jumping in front of the bullet for a loved one) will still dominate. Dilemmas are situations where a single desire may not dominate, so maybe a discovery of priorities are in order.
The devil is in the details here. The 14 year old wants to date their crush. Maybe even to know if they should move on. The 14 year old wants to avoid a situation where their crush laughs in their face, loudly announcing to the school that they thought they had a chance. If you can guarantee that they get laughed at, and ask them if they want to ask their crush out still, it’s going to be an easy “No thanks”.
But it’s hard to know, in general. Asking means maybe getting what you want, and maybe getting what you don’t want. And therefore you’ll feel drawn towards asking, but also hesitate in fear of what could go wrong. It’s not that you simultaneously “want to ask” and “want to not ask”, or “want to ask” and “fear asking”. It’s that you want to ask [and have it go well] and want to not ask [and have it go poorly]. When you fill in the missing details, the picture gets clearer.
The difficulty in making these decisions is in knowing whether it’s worth the risk—and knowing that it’s not worth learning more about the risk before committing. Once you can say “I want to ask and maybe get laughed at”—which again, is the reality of what “asking” means—then you’ve actually decided whether you want the uncertain outcome of asking. It’s at that point that you can accurately say that you want to ask out your crush, without the hidden “[and have it go well]” qualification.
”Wanting to maybe get laughed at” is a bizarre feeling, because we’re so used to trying to get the good without risking the bad (and for good reason!), but it’s a completely real experience, and a valuable one when the uncertainty is irreducible. The “fear” starts to feel more like “excitement”, and all of a sudden you’re more prepared to smile while being laughed at, because it no longer means you shouldn’t have asked.
I don’t think “do more default” alone is enough to get people there very often, but “don’t try so much to force yourself to do things you’re afraid of” does threaten to take those things that you want, and that does increase the pressure to want the scary things. And doing things that scare you is a lot more fun when you actually want the scary too.
I like your suggestion, gives me the same vibes as the adage of flipping a coin for a difficult decision because you will know what you subconsciously want when the coin’s in the air. Maybe I should have written a longer article instead of slightly aiming for aesthetics—but I will argue that all of such insights—eventually converge to all actions feeling default.
You seem to be playing this game where you redefine “want”, and then use it to prove that people actually don’t want things (according to your non-standard definition).
“A heroin addict wants heroin” is the most straightforward way I can define want.
Yes, but if you narrow “want” to this level, then almost no one other than heroin addicts actually wants anything.
I want a glass of water/I want to write this comment/I want to listen to a song/I don’t want to solve global peace, but I want global peace to be solved.
I’m not addicted to heroin, but I am addicted to other stuff, and I often wouldn’t call it “wanting” the stuff, but “having an urge”. Like doomscrolling. It would be a stretch to say (in ordinary language) I want to doomscroll. I don’t want to doomscroll but I have an urge to doomscroll.
What’s the difference between an urge and a want?
Maybe the want comes from the cortex, while the urge comes from the cerebellum. Or the want comes from the superego, while the urge comes from the id. Though I agree that at other times it doesn’t feel necessary to talk of urges. I distinguished two different explanations here. One with urges vs wants, one with “want” vs “want to want”. Though you already touched on the latter.