So I recently had a lot of fun reading HPMOR and the sequences, and I feel like I learned a bunch of cool things and new ways of looking at the world! I’ve also been trying to get my friends interested in the rationality community, particularly through the works of Eliezer. There, however, appeared an unexpected obstacle in my way. My friends saw a picture of Eliezer and immediately wondered, “If Eliezer is so rational (at least relative to other people) and also has living as long as possible high on his preference ordering, why is he fat?” It does seem like something that ought not take that much effort but has an overwhelmingly positive impact on one’s life. health-wise, and maybe even performance-wise. I initially jokingly brushed the question off, saying his work is too important and doesn’t leave him enough time to optimize his health, or that maybe he has some condition that prevents him from losing weight.
But the question stuck with me.
Copying from X:
(I answered some additional questions in replies to the tweet.)
Goodness gracious, reading this and the replies in the thread, it looks like you have tried everything.
The only other thing I can think of to suggest is “move to Europe for a month” (although this would massively complicate drug acquisition, among other things). What tipped me over the edge was seeing a Twitter conversation that went something like this:
No, I don’t have a good causal theory for why this seems to work for some people.
that’s not enough for maintaining your lean frame—have you ever looked up the definition for atypical anorexia
re: “I am not interested in your diet advice unless you have evidence about something that works for people who have metabolic disorders that have resisted fairly extraordinary efforts.”
The problem is that you are focused on the wrong goal - ‘how to lose weight’ - rather than the goal of ‘how do I recover from atypical anorexia without gaining fat the way I used to when I ate normal quantities’
for that second goal, the one of recovery of muscle without boundless fat gain, start testing your CGM reaction to different types of foods eaten on their own.
You’re looking for the opposite of the prediabetes/T2D pattern—that pattern has high variability of BG (which you can see) and insulin (which you can’t see, we don’t have monitors for that, but you could look up the work of Frank Q Nutall and Mary Gannon to get some idea).
Ketone monitors are a pretty good proxy for lower insulin levels.
What you want are foods which have a lower BG response, less variability, with a return to producing ketones relatively soon after the meal.
Test whatever you think could be good.
When you are testing meats, try different fat ratios—frozen patties or plain fast food patties are good for this testing because they have standard ratios you can look up.
Try meats from 10% protein ratio (may have to add fat) to 30% protein ratio. Ratios are measured by calorie not by weight/grams.For muscle recovery, meat will give you the most complete protein bang for your calorie buck. Good to learn your responses to diff ratios.
Once you know your responses to meat—compare meat + a vegetable, to see if any difference. Try classic diet vegetables (lettuce, green beans, tomatoes) avoiding the goitrogenic ones which can slow metabolism via thyroid action. (avoid cabbage, broccoli, cauliflower, mustards, etc)
The reason theT2D/prediabetes pattern is so problematic is bc it leads to muscle breakdown between meals. Nourishment ends up going preferentially to adipose tissue. That’s why you want to avoid that pattern. (There is reaearch on the endocrinological mileu around sarcopenia and T2D if you want a rabbit hole to go down.)
***
In review. you want to be able to eat in order to restore your lean frame which has become frail from your undereating.
To do that, test and find the foods which have lowest BG response, fastest return to producing ketones (ketones indicating your insulin has moved out of the higher range)
You’ll need to eat normal quantities in order to recover from your underlying frailty. You need to give your body the resources it needs to build muscle and bone density. It cannot do it without amino acids and fatty acids.
That part may be hard for you because of your anorexia, since gaining muscle will involve gaining weight.
[An expert in anorexia recovery, the clinician with the best results, many times better than conventional treatment, Dr Agnes Ayton. She teaches at Oxford. She has published on the efficacy of her clinic’s approach.]
For examples of ppl who have recovered from anorexia, with this approach see Dr Nick Norwitz et al, https://journalofmetabolichealth.org/index.php/jmh/article/view/84
I wish you well restoring your health
Actual answer is that Eliezer has tried a bunch of different things to lose weight and it’s just pretty hard. (He also did a quite high-effort thing in 2019 which did work. I don’t know how well he kept the pounds off in the subsequent time)
You can watch a fun video where he discusses it after the 2019 Solstice here.
(I’m not really sure how I feel about this post. It seems like it’s coming from an earnest place, and I kinda expect a other people to have this question, but it’s in a genre that feels pretty off to be picking on individual people about and I definitely don’t want a bunch more questions similar to this on the site. I settled for downvoting but answering the question)
I’m kinda confused why this is only mentioned in one answer, and in parentheses. Shouldn’t this be the main answer—like, hello, the premise is likely false? (Even if it’s not epistemically likely, I feel like one should politely not assume that he since gained weight unless one has evidence for this.)
This is a perfectly reasonable question. No one wants to be fat, so it follows that no highly competent individual will be fat.
Turns out, it’s just a very difficult problem, and that degree of difficulty also varies greatly between people. It’s far more difficult for certain individuals than for others.
No one really knows why, yet. If they did, we’d all be thin and healthy again.
Because his rational mind is bolted to an evolved lower brain that betrays him with slightly incorrect preference for extra calories when calories are plentiful.
And the conservation of willpower hypothesis says if he fixes his fatness through willpower this comes at the cost of other things.
Eliezer should probably go get a semaglutide or tirzepatide script like everyone else and lose the extra weight. Literally until a few years ago no clinically validated method of weight loss, save extremely dangerous gastric bypass surgery, existed. Diet and exercise do not work for most people.
Epistemic status : I am also slightly fat, though thinner than EY, and intend to cheat with these new drugs soon.
How did it go?