My own takeaway from your story getting traction has been to tell people that Pangram seems to now be prominent enough that they should run their writing through it and see if it gets flagged, and if it does, get some LLM to generate a few variants until it doesn’t anymore.
This just seems straight-up antisocial, borderline evil. Why do you hate good things?
I considered that explanation, but given how low Pangram’s false positive rates are, it seems unlikely that Shankar knows multiple people in that position. Seems much more likely that the default effect of this advice is to get people to repeatedly try their AI-generated writing against Pangram.
I’d answer to that description. I aspire to live by the maxim, “I may quarrel with my brother, we may quarrel with our cousins, but it’s family together against the world,” and I agree by most reasonable definitions, my explicit rejection of any imputed obligation to act against my friends and family for the benefit of broader society would be antisocial. I simply hold (personal) loyalty to be a higher principle, and in this case, even granting the premise that this works as well as claimed, yes, I indeed prefer to warn my friends and colleagues of a trap they may not have seen to letting them fall in either as intended target or acceptable collateral of your “good things,” which you’ll note continue to work only imperceptibly less well from your perspective, ineffective (or at least, so I hope) only against the negligibly small group who heed my warning and take my advice.
borderline evil
I wouldn’t consider myself an expert on how conventional morality is typically reckoned – I find it an incoherent mess of ad hoc justifications with no consistent principles – but on this, I’d wager a significant fraction of people agree with me.
(I didn’t downvote)
This just seems straight-up antisocial, borderline evil. Why do you hate good things?
I think he means “their legitimately self-authored writing”, not “their ai-generated writing”.
I considered that explanation, but given how low Pangram’s false positive rates are, it seems unlikely that Shankar knows multiple people in that position. Seems much more likely that the default effect of this advice is to get people to repeatedly try their AI-generated writing against Pangram.
I’d answer to that description. I aspire to live by the maxim, “I may quarrel with my brother, we may quarrel with our cousins, but it’s family together against the world,” and I agree by most reasonable definitions, my explicit rejection of any imputed obligation to act against my friends and family for the benefit of broader society would be antisocial. I simply hold (personal) loyalty to be a higher principle, and in this case, even granting the premise that this works as well as claimed, yes, I indeed prefer to warn my friends and colleagues of a trap they may not have seen to letting them fall in either as intended target or acceptable collateral of your “good things,” which you’ll note continue to work only imperceptibly less well from your perspective, ineffective (or at least, so I hope) only against the negligibly small group who heed my warning and take my advice.
I wouldn’t consider myself an expert on how conventional morality is typically reckoned – I find it an incoherent mess of ad hoc justifications with no consistent principles – but on this, I’d wager a significant fraction of people agree with me.
Do you also actively go out of your way to recommend your friends and family cheat in general?