I don’t think your posts suggest or says anywhere that the CIA knew about Epstein’s ongoing pedophilic operation. If you think it does you should quote that relevant section instead of telling me to re-read the post. But if you’re saying here that you do think that the CIA knew about Epstein’s pedophilic operation then that’s well and good.
Now, the analysis that I’m thinking of is connecting this inference to the ability of conspirators to murder Epstein. The fact that the CIA knows about and actively encourages the pimping out of underaged girls implies that the CIA really is full of absolute rule-followers who would kill their own grandmother if the agency asked them to. That means that it really doesn’t make any sense to trust any report made by them or a sister agency on potential security breaches at Epstein’s jail.
I think we miscommunicated. The entire third portion of my post is dedicated to the possibility that Epstein was a CIA agent and that his handlers vouched for his status as an informant with his prosecution. Clearly, in order to do that, they need to eventually become aware that he founded a ring of underage prostitutes, and protect him either as a reward for past information or so that he can be of more help in the future. This is the opening to that portion of my post:
That leaves the second mystery. How did Jeffrey Epstein get 12 months in prison along with 12 hours a day of “work release” for raping dozens of underage girls?
He was probably a CIA agent.
I think what you were asking is actually whether or not they became aware of this before the plea. Of that I’m not sure. However, in response to your second paragraph:
The fact that the CIA knows about and actively encourages the pimping out of underaged girls implies that the CIA really is full of absolute rule-followers who would kill their own grandmother if the agency asked them to.
I think you’re conflating possibilities. There’s:
The possibility that the CIA did not know about his crimes until the FBI investigated and charged him. This is something I actually find very plausible. The CIA’s job isn’t to investigate its sources for personal vice crimes, it’s to gather and verify the integrity of information pertinent to national defense. The CIA probably has an incentive not to uncover criminal or unethical activity by its agents, especially American agents, because that would start pesky ethical dilemmas. Perhaps that’s a different sort of moral failure, but that’s besides the point.
Thereafter, there’s a 1a and 1b possibility, that the CIA either broke off contact with him after the plea agreement, or at least intended to keep him on as an agent despite obviously being aware of his crimes. I think both are possible—the CIA might have decided he was too risky an agent to conduct business with and burned him, or maybe they decided they’d try to milk him further anyways. Either way, most of the investigative journalists like Vicky Ward suggest that he was of little use. When it became public knowledge what he’d gotten himself into, he was cut out of most of the elite circles he was previously part of and most of his former business contacts no longer trusted him to be a reliable partner.
The possibility that the CIA eventually learned about his criminal activity and looked the other way. This is also plausible. Just like the FBI, the CIA is pretty comfortable with, and is often forced to, take the help of very evil people. In certain circumstances the CIA has maintained relationships with active terrorists like Ali Hassan Salameh. I find this unlikely however, simply because it means they’d have to find out before the FBI did. I also find it unlikely in a smaller sense because handling an agent committing crimes against Americans is a different political and legal minefield altogether than handling a criminal or even a terrorist against people of a different nation.
The possibility that the CIA used his status as an American brothel-master to blackmail and turn other agents. This I find pretty unlikely partly because it would explicitly make those CIA officers criminals and put them at risk of prosecution, partly because I suspect it’d be beyond the pale for at least some of the CIA officers that would have to be involved, but primarily because none of the people accused by Epstein’s victims seem all that useful for the purposes of national intelligence. The only foreign person of interest that I know of that’s been fingered by his victims is Prince Andrew, who I don’t think has much access to military intelligence and is already a citizen of America’s strongest military ally. His ring of pedophiles just seems way less useful to the intelligence community than the Middle Eastern contacts he developed in his dayjob.
The possibility that the CIA actively helped Epstein developed his prostitution ring in order to trap potential agents, and then along the way stringed a bunch of random Americans and American-allies as some sort of false flag. This I find ridiculous.
And then there’s this:
That means that it really doesn’t make any sense to trust any report made by a similar agency on potential security breaches at Epstein’s jail.
The FBI and the CIA are staffed by very different people and have pretty different recruitment processes and requirements. Knowing that the CIA acted unethically in this way would say something about the potential of misconduct inside the intelligence/LEO in a first world country, but they’re not really “similar agencies” in the sense that’s probably relevant. I wouldn’t assume that just because CIA officers are willing to break the law that FBI agents are.
1.5 The officer within the CIA who investigated Epstein knew, but he got promoted based on how many agents he had and how useful they were, so he kept quiet. Had he turned Epstein in, he’d have gotten some kudos for that, but it wouldn’t have been as good a career move. Had he reported up the chain, his commanding officer might have decided to sacrifice the original officer’s career for greater justice, so he didn’t do that either. Whoever set up this incentive system didn’t anticipate this particular scenario.
This is the thing about conspiracy theories: they usually don’t require very much actual conspiring.
I don’t think your posts suggest or says anywhere that the CIA knew about Epstein’s ongoing pedophilic operation. If you think it does you should quote that relevant section instead of telling me to re-read the post. But if you’re saying here that you do think that the CIA knew about Epstein’s pedophilic operation then that’s well and good.
Now, the analysis that I’m thinking of is connecting this inference to the ability of conspirators to murder Epstein. The fact that the CIA knows about and actively encourages the pimping out of underaged girls implies that the CIA really is full of absolute rule-followers who would kill their own grandmother if the agency asked them to. That means that it really doesn’t make any sense to trust any report made by them or a sister agency on potential security breaches at Epstein’s jail.
edit: tone
I think we miscommunicated. The entire third portion of my post is dedicated to the possibility that Epstein was a CIA agent and that his handlers vouched for his status as an informant with his prosecution. Clearly, in order to do that, they need to eventually become aware that he founded a ring of underage prostitutes, and protect him either as a reward for past information or so that he can be of more help in the future. This is the opening to that portion of my post:
I think what you were asking is actually whether or not they became aware of this before the plea. Of that I’m not sure. However, in response to your second paragraph:
I think you’re conflating possibilities. There’s:
The possibility that the CIA did not know about his crimes until the FBI investigated and charged him. This is something I actually find very plausible. The CIA’s job isn’t to investigate its sources for personal vice crimes, it’s to gather and verify the integrity of information pertinent to national defense. The CIA probably has an incentive not to uncover criminal or unethical activity by its agents, especially American agents, because that would start pesky ethical dilemmas. Perhaps that’s a different sort of moral failure, but that’s besides the point.
Thereafter, there’s a 1a and 1b possibility, that the CIA either broke off contact with him after the plea agreement, or at least intended to keep him on as an agent despite obviously being aware of his crimes. I think both are possible—the CIA might have decided he was too risky an agent to conduct business with and burned him, or maybe they decided they’d try to milk him further anyways. Either way, most of the investigative journalists like Vicky Ward suggest that he was of little use. When it became public knowledge what he’d gotten himself into, he was cut out of most of the elite circles he was previously part of and most of his former business contacts no longer trusted him to be a reliable partner.
The possibility that the CIA eventually learned about his criminal activity and looked the other way. This is also plausible. Just like the FBI, the CIA is pretty comfortable with, and is often forced to, take the help of very evil people. In certain circumstances the CIA has maintained relationships with active terrorists like Ali Hassan Salameh. I find this unlikely however, simply because it means they’d have to find out before the FBI did. I also find it unlikely in a smaller sense because handling an agent committing crimes against Americans is a different political and legal minefield altogether than handling a criminal or even a terrorist against people of a different nation.
The possibility that the CIA used his status as an American brothel-master to blackmail and turn other agents. This I find pretty unlikely partly because it would explicitly make those CIA officers criminals and put them at risk of prosecution, partly because I suspect it’d be beyond the pale for at least some of the CIA officers that would have to be involved, but primarily because none of the people accused by Epstein’s victims seem all that useful for the purposes of national intelligence. The only foreign person of interest that I know of that’s been fingered by his victims is Prince Andrew, who I don’t think has much access to military intelligence and is already a citizen of America’s strongest military ally. His ring of pedophiles just seems way less useful to the intelligence community than the Middle Eastern contacts he developed in his dayjob.
The possibility that the CIA actively helped Epstein developed his prostitution ring in order to trap potential agents, and then along the way stringed a bunch of random Americans and American-allies as some sort of false flag. This I find ridiculous.
And then there’s this:
The FBI and the CIA are staffed by very different people and have pretty different recruitment processes and requirements. Knowing that the CIA acted unethically in this way would say something about the potential of misconduct inside the intelligence/LEO in a first world country, but they’re not really “similar agencies” in the sense that’s probably relevant. I wouldn’t assume that just because CIA officers are willing to break the law that FBI agents are.
1.5 The officer within the CIA who investigated Epstein knew, but he got promoted based on how many agents he had and how useful they were, so he kept quiet. Had he turned Epstein in, he’d have gotten some kudos for that, but it wouldn’t have been as good a career move. Had he reported up the chain, his commanding officer might have decided to sacrifice the original officer’s career for greater justice, so he didn’t do that either. Whoever set up this incentive system didn’t anticipate this particular scenario.
This is the thing about conspiracy theories: they usually don’t require very much actual conspiring.
Yeah that is also possible.