I’d love to see a top-level post on this, with a few examples more specific than “kids today are coddled and weak” (which I don’t know if you’re saying but a lot of non-LW people have said). I had a really unpleasant time in early grades, before I found my clique of nerds in high school, and I’d love to hear recommendations of what parts of that experience should be preserved for others.
Based on my experiences, I tend to believe that “consent” in roughhousing and verbal put-downs, especially for pre-teen children (though young adulthood for some), is impossible—some participants are mostly victims, and they don’t have a way to opt out.
I do see the point that a whole lot of things (and people) in life are unpleasant and unavoidable, and it’s better for most to learn coping strategies early rather than being unprepared. At early ages, I learned mostly avoidance and anger, but got more sophisticated later. I hope many would have the support and more diverse social experiences to learn better responses earlier, but it’s hard for me to recommend it.
Maybe this is just another case of avoiding typical mind fallacy and recognizing that one size does not fit all. I’m happy to be reminded that a somewhat adversarial culture is considered a good thing by some.
I’d love to see a top-level post on this, with a few examples more specific than “kids today are coddled and weak” (which I don’t know if you’re saying but a lot of non-LW people have said). I had a really unpleasant time in early grades, before I found my clique of nerds in high school, and I’d love to hear recommendations of what parts of that experience should be preserved for others.
Based on my experiences, I tend to believe that “consent” in roughhousing and verbal put-downs, especially for pre-teen children (though young adulthood for some), is impossible—some participants are mostly victims, and they don’t have a way to opt out.
I do see the point that a whole lot of things (and people) in life are unpleasant and unavoidable, and it’s better for most to learn coping strategies early rather than being unprepared. At early ages, I learned mostly avoidance and anger, but got more sophisticated later. I hope many would have the support and more diverse social experiences to learn better responses earlier, but it’s hard for me to recommend it.
Maybe this is just another case of avoiding typical mind fallacy and recognizing that one size does not fit all. I’m happy to be reminded that a somewhat adversarial culture is considered a good thing by some.
I think consent can be obtained often, but also if only the skilled version of something is allowed then de facto kids aren’t allowed to do it.
A corollary: if only the skilled version of something is allowed, then learning the skill is de facto not allowed.