When it comes to reading articles here on LW I don’t get the feeling that everything that could be said is said. Pleading directly for getting rid of the self wouldn’t fit into the overton window. Just like issues regarding the t-word or the e-word are unlikely to be expressed. To be fair there’s a bit of discussion about the e-word but not in this context.
The word arbitrary is a bit suspect to me. If I would hear a rationalist who says that his love for his wife is arbitrary because it’s what evolution programmed into him my instinct would be that there’s an issue with how he’s in relationship.
I get the same sentiment when I hear you speak about how your self is arbitrary in this context.
When it comes to the reports of memory loss in the comments of the PNSE paper (and Richard’s comment) I don’t see why that would come with the ability to look but I can see that cutting connections to the self could lead to such issues.
More practically I have the concern of taking meditation advice from Buddhists who’s goal is a state of detachment from the self or simply following what they recommend (and what’s designed for the outcome of creating detachment) might be problematic.
Of course I might also very well have misunderstood where you or Valentine are and it’s not an easy topic to talk about, especially in a text-based public venue like this.
When it comes to reading articles here on LW I don’t get the feeling that everything that could be said is said. Pleading directly for getting rid of the self wouldn’t fit into the overton window.
Well, if you suspect that I have a hidden agenda which I’m not stating for strategic reasons, I don’t know if I can say anything that would convince you otherwise.
I can only say that I have no interest in broad renunciation, and that at least everything that I’ve been doing so far—including my no-self experiences—has only felt liberating; to the extent that it has affected my ability to influence the world, it has felt like I’ve gotten more agency and ability to influence the world, not less. (Though a lot of it has been purely neutral too.) If some meditation technique starts feeling like it’s reducing my ability to achieve things in the world, then I will stop using that technique and try some other technique instead.
Re: arbitrary—I don’t think I have the same connotations for the word as you do. A lot of things can be arbitrary and still be valuable.
When it comes to reading articles here on LW I don’t get the feeling that everything that could be said is said.
Pleading directly for getting rid of the self wouldn’t fit into the overton window. Just like issues regarding the t-word or the e-word are unlikely to be expressed. To be fair there’s a bit of discussion about the e-word but not in this context.
The word arbitrary is a bit suspect to me. If I would hear a rationalist who says that his love for his wife is arbitrary because it’s what evolution programmed into him my instinct would be that there’s an issue with how he’s in relationship.
I get the same sentiment when I hear you speak about how your self is arbitrary in this context.
When it comes to the reports of memory loss in the comments of the PNSE paper (and Richard’s comment) I don’t see why that would come with the ability to look but I can see that cutting connections to the self could lead to such issues.
More practically I have the concern of taking meditation advice from Buddhists who’s goal is a state of detachment from the self or simply following what they recommend (and what’s designed for the outcome of creating detachment) might be problematic.
Of course I might also very well have misunderstood where you or Valentine are and it’s not an easy topic to talk about, especially in a text-based public venue like this.
Well, if you suspect that I have a hidden agenda which I’m not stating for strategic reasons, I don’t know if I can say anything that would convince you otherwise.
I can only say that I have no interest in broad renunciation, and that at least everything that I’ve been doing so far—including my no-self experiences—has only felt liberating; to the extent that it has affected my ability to influence the world, it has felt like I’ve gotten more agency and ability to influence the world, not less. (Though a lot of it has been purely neutral too.) If some meditation technique starts feeling like it’s reducing my ability to achieve things in the world, then I will stop using that technique and try some other technique instead.
Re: arbitrary—I don’t think I have the same connotations for the word as you do. A lot of things can be arbitrary and still be valuable.
You don’t need to have an agenda of wanting to renounce the self to practice techniques that have that result.