Eh, I think America really has been the bastion of classical liberalism in the past 200+ years, and my guess is history would be a lot worse without it. I grew up in Germany, and certainly have much less respect for the history of that country.
I do think nationalism is tricky and somewhat mindkilly so I toned down some of the language in the OP.
(Also you’re not American so shouldn’t have been indoctrinated in that.)
I went through all the effort to immigrate to the US, so of course I think it’s pretty great! It’s true I’ve experienced close to zero indoctrination about American greatness though (indeed my high-school education for some reason really kept emphasizing the french revolution as the birthplace of western democracy, weirdly downplaying the American revolution, despite the timing really not checking out).
Macrohistory of this kind is pretty tricky, so all of this should be taken with a lot of grains of salt. Unfortunately, I don’t really know how to avoid it if I want actual data about how to build good and lasting institutions.
The ‘conquering’ wasn’t done ‘by democracy/goodness’, nor in its name
Yep, indeed. Trying to figure out how to relate to being part of an effort where much of what is being done and achieved is not done in the name of goodness is one of the key things I am trying to figure out in the essay. Most things are done in the name of self-interest and profit and various other things. This does not make them automatically opposed to the good, or something you should not engage with.
(further, democracy isn’t an American invention or export, and isn’t exactly thriving in America now).
Yep, both true. Indeed, I think I am pretty explicit in the post that there is a broader civilization that it is an outgrowth off. Sorry if that didn’t come across! And I certainly am finding myself very quite deeply dismayed at the lack of thriving of democracy in America.
The earlier constitutional moments of the US came long after the original colonies, and long before the eventual complete colonisation. The later constitutional moments occurred after colonisation was already history.
Yep, there was a lot of period in-between, and this makes this all tricky to analyze. I think it’s a reasonable structural objection to the argument to go “but some of these things you are saying were part of the same effort are like 150+ years apart, and done by very different people, what is the point of putting them in the same bucket?”.
Yep, I think the United States was a straightforward example of France and Britain conquering something they cannot defend! And again, that makes it a particularly interesting example to analyze the maxim of yesterday’s post through. This post is intentionally designed as being an antithesis to a lot of the vibe’s of yesterday’s post, so of course it’s going to be substantially in tension with it.
Eh, I think America really has been the bastion of classical liberalism in the past 200+ years, and my guess is history would be a lot worse without it. I grew up in Germany, and certainly have much less respect for the history of that country.
I do think nationalism is tricky and somewhat mindkilly so I toned down some of the language in the OP.
I went through all the effort to immigrate to the US, so of course I think it’s pretty great! It’s true I’ve experienced close to zero indoctrination about American greatness though (indeed my high-school education for some reason really kept emphasizing the french revolution as the birthplace of western democracy, weirdly downplaying the American revolution, despite the timing really not checking out).
Macrohistory of this kind is pretty tricky, so all of this should be taken with a lot of grains of salt. Unfortunately, I don’t really know how to avoid it if I want actual data about how to build good and lasting institutions.
Yep, indeed. Trying to figure out how to relate to being part of an effort where much of what is being done and achieved is not done in the name of goodness is one of the key things I am trying to figure out in the essay. Most things are done in the name of self-interest and profit and various other things. This does not make them automatically opposed to the good, or something you should not engage with.
Yep, both true. Indeed, I think I am pretty explicit in the post that there is a broader civilization that it is an outgrowth off. Sorry if that didn’t come across! And I certainly am finding myself very quite deeply dismayed at the lack of thriving of democracy in America.
Yep, there was a lot of period in-between, and this makes this all tricky to analyze. I think it’s a reasonable structural objection to the argument to go “but some of these things you are saying were part of the same effort are like 150+ years apart, and done by very different people, what is the point of putting them in the same bucket?”.
Yep, I think the United States was a straightforward example of France and Britain conquering something they cannot defend! And again, that makes it a particularly interesting example to analyze the maxim of yesterday’s post through. This post is intentionally designed as being an antithesis to a lot of the vibe’s of yesterday’s post, so of course it’s going to be substantially in tension with it.