You seem to have a somewhat idiosyncratic interpretation of “lying’ (or I do—might be a cultural thing). My understanding of lying is “saying something you know to be untrue”.
Your definition of lying is exactly my own. The difference is that I take “knowing to be untrue” as enough, without requiring that they also narrate “This is a lie, teehee!” as they do it. People rarely do that when saying things they know to be untrue. Because that behavior is conditioned against for obvious reasons.
Far more often, people will say thing they know to be true without admitting to themselves that they know it to be true. They’ll even narrate to themselves the opposite. Because that way, people will conflate “Hasn’t admitted to themselves, against their own interests, that they know that what they’re saying is untrue” with “Doesn’t know that what they’re saying is untrue”, and run defense for them.
You have to distinguish between beliefs and metabeliefs, lies and meta lies, intent and meta intent, or else you end up running defense for people who intentionally choose to say things they know to be untrue, because they would rather mislead in self serving ways than speak the truth, and they know you won’t hold them accountable.
Wait, I’m confused. What is the difference between not admitting to themselves and not knowing? Do you mean something like subconsciously knowing? Or maybe cognitive dissonance?
Your definition of lying is exactly my own. The difference is that I take “knowing to be untrue” as enough, without requiring that they also narrate “This is a lie, teehee!” as they do it. People rarely do that when saying things they know to be untrue. Because that behavior is conditioned against for obvious reasons.
Far more often, people will say thing they know to be true without admitting to themselves that they know it to be true. They’ll even narrate to themselves the opposite. Because that way, people will conflate “Hasn’t admitted to themselves, against their own interests, that they know that what they’re saying is untrue” with “Doesn’t know that what they’re saying is untrue”, and run defense for them.
You have to distinguish between beliefs and metabeliefs, lies and meta lies, intent and meta intent, or else you end up running defense for people who intentionally choose to say things they know to be untrue, because they would rather mislead in self serving ways than speak the truth, and they know you won’t hold them accountable.
Wait, I’m confused. What is the difference between not admitting to themselves and not knowing? Do you mean something like subconsciously knowing? Or maybe cognitive dissonance?