How can we be sure it’s sometimes necessary if there could be another layer of deception underneath? (due to the aforementioned propensity of human’s mind where lies induce more lies)
My models of morality and of bounded rationality make me highly suspicious of any claim of surety. But in this case, I’m also unclear on what you’re asking. Perhaps if you can give two examples, one on each side of the line, we can generalize from there. Or, more likely, we’ll disagree on something and identify an underlying disagreement in our models.
I mean, there’s ALWAYS more layers of human-level modeling of each other. Whether that layer is deception, honest mistake, or shared truth-seeking becomes really hard to know or use after a few levels.
My models of morality and of bounded rationality make me highly suspicious of any claim of surety. But in this case, I’m also unclear on what you’re asking. Perhaps if you can give two examples, one on each side of the line, we can generalize from there.
Well this is an interesting dilemma.
I can’t provide ‘two example on each side of the line’ because I’ve only ever heard of activities related to “hiding innocent victims from evil oppressors” from third-hand sources, who also have fallible minds probably containing multiple lies. Nor can I tell exactly where the line is because I’ve likely also self-deceived in some capacity.
Considering the real situation of adults circa 2022, where everyone likely has deceived themselves with at least a few lies, how could this conversation continue?
How can we be sure it’s sometimes necessary if there could be another layer of deception underneath? (due to the aforementioned propensity of human’s mind where lies induce more lies)
My models of morality and of bounded rationality make me highly suspicious of any claim of surety. But in this case, I’m also unclear on what you’re asking. Perhaps if you can give two examples, one on each side of the line, we can generalize from there. Or, more likely, we’ll disagree on something and identify an underlying disagreement in our models.
I mean, there’s ALWAYS more layers of human-level modeling of each other. Whether that layer is deception, honest mistake, or shared truth-seeking becomes really hard to know or use after a few levels.
Well this is an interesting dilemma.
I can’t provide ‘two example on each side of the line’ because I’ve only ever heard of activities related to “hiding innocent victims from evil oppressors” from third-hand sources, who also have fallible minds probably containing multiple lies. Nor can I tell exactly where the line is because I’ve likely also self-deceived in some capacity.
Considering the real situation of adults circa 2022, where everyone likely has deceived themselves with at least a few lies, how could this conversation continue?