Maybe… but here’s the thing: Uniforms actually ARE a very cultish thing. They are one of the quantitative traits that can add up into driving you into the cult attractor. The proper rationalist response is actually “I will not wear the hat, because I don’t want to and you’ve not given me a reason to.”
The only sort of “uniform” that is rationally justifiable is something like body armor, or a hazmat suit, or a labcoat; sure, it’s all the same, because it SERVES A PURPOSE—there’s a reason soldiers wear Kevlar instead of tissue paper. But if you can’t actually justify the uniform (like a nurse hat, or epaulettes, or the Pope’s miter), then it really IS a bad sign that you are slipping into irrationality.
The line isn’t nearly as crisp as you make it sound.
For example, is a nurse’s uniform as “rationally justifiable” as a hazmat suit? No. But it does serve a useful purpose for nurses, in that it frequently makes patients more likely to treat them as authority figures.
Now, you might ask why patients do that, but in some sense that doesn’t matter. Even if patients are irrational to do that, it is still pragmatically useful for nurses to wear the uniform if it reliably obtains that benefit.
But in fact it isn’t a senseless thing for patients to do, either, in that wearing a nurse’s uniform is a more costly signal if I’m not a nurse than simply saying “I’m a nurse” (since other nurses might see me wearing the uniform and punish me), and therefore more reliable than simply saying that.
More generally: uniforms are one way humans signal a certain kind of social status, and status signaling is a valuable function.
Why are almost all fire trucks red? They would work just as well if they were blue and yellow polka dots. But they are uniform because they are recognizable.The same with the blue-white-red lights on a police car and the sirens.
A nurse’s uniform tells you that this is probably a nurse, even in contexts where the scrubs are not useful. A monk’s or priest’s robes tell you that this is a religious person who might give you religious advice. The act of picking a uniform for a group lets you begin to associate some properties of that group with the people in it, at a glance.
Maybe… but here’s the thing: Uniforms actually ARE a very cultish thing.
I think Tiiba2 perfectly addressed this with
In general P(Category|Feature) != P(Feature|Category).
It helps to have read An Intuitive Explanation of Bayes’ Theorem, but the short of it is this: The majority are not in cults. The minority are in cults. The minority of non-cults may wear uniforms, and the majority of cults may wear uniforms. The majority of the minority is not necessarily greater than the minority of the majority. So taking uniforms to mean cults is kind of intuitive, but not necessarily true.
If, for instance, your stamp collecting club decides they should all wear matching t-shirts at their meetings, it doesn’t mean they’ve crossed the line into becoming a cult, just that they want to wear matching t-shirts.
It is possible that wearing uniforms not only is evidence that your group is a cult (though it might be weak evidence, as you say) but also may contribute to your group becoming a cult. I can think of at least three somewhat plausible mechanisms. (1) Having a uniform may attract people who want to be in a cult and/or scare off people who very much want not to be in one. (2) Having a uniform may foster a sense of unity and conformity that makes cultishness come more naturally. (3) Having agreed to do something silly (like wearing a uniform) may put you in a frame of mind where you’re more likely to agree to other silly things the leader of the group asks you to do later.
(3) Having agreed to do something silly (like wearing a uniform) may put you in a frame of mind where you’re more likely to agree to other silly things the leader of the group asks you to do later.
Why are uniforms necessarily silly? Let’s take military dress uniforms. In the US, you can tell a military member’s rank and branch of service, and even get an idea of their service record, just by looking at their dress uniform. To insiders, this can be rapidly gleaned looking at someone from across a room. With millions of members, individuals cannot possibly be expected to know everybody else and so the uniform serves a useful function.
Wearing a uniform is not always silly; as you say, sometimes there are compelling reasons for it. However, sometimes there are no such compelling reasons, and in that case wearing a uniform is (at least prima facie) pointless. In the scenario under discussion, no reason for wearing a uniform is provided (or apparent) other than “the leader says we have to”.
If you want the group to acquire a collective reputation among other people, a uniform is useful. If Boy Scouts never chose a uniform, it would have been very hard for them to get their reputation for above-average conscientiousness and obedience to authority.
If you want to get a reputation as being good at solving problems (which Ougi’s group may), it is useful to have a shared appearance.
If Boy Scouts never chose a uniform, it would have been very hard for them to get their reputation for above-average conscientiousness and obedience to authority.
Eh, more the first than the second. Obedience to authority is something you can demonstrate by showing up and obeying; conscientiousness is mostly demonstrated when you do things while no one is watching and they are the things you’d do if someone was watching.
Maybe… but here’s the thing: Uniforms actually ARE a very cultish thing. They are one of the quantitative traits that can add up into driving you into the cult attractor. The proper rationalist response is actually “I will not wear the hat, because I don’t want to and you’ve not given me a reason to.”
The only sort of “uniform” that is rationally justifiable is something like body armor, or a hazmat suit, or a labcoat; sure, it’s all the same, because it SERVES A PURPOSE—there’s a reason soldiers wear Kevlar instead of tissue paper. But if you can’t actually justify the uniform (like a nurse hat, or epaulettes, or the Pope’s miter), then it really IS a bad sign that you are slipping into irrationality.
The line isn’t nearly as crisp as you make it sound.
For example, is a nurse’s uniform as “rationally justifiable” as a hazmat suit? No. But it does serve a useful purpose for nurses, in that it frequently makes patients more likely to treat them as authority figures.
Now, you might ask why patients do that, but in some sense that doesn’t matter. Even if patients are irrational to do that, it is still pragmatically useful for nurses to wear the uniform if it reliably obtains that benefit.
But in fact it isn’t a senseless thing for patients to do, either, in that wearing a nurse’s uniform is a more costly signal if I’m not a nurse than simply saying “I’m a nurse” (since other nurses might see me wearing the uniform and punish me), and therefore more reliable than simply saying that.
More generally: uniforms are one way humans signal a certain kind of social status, and status signaling is a valuable function.
Why are almost all fire trucks red? They would work just as well if they were blue and yellow polka dots. But they are uniform because they are recognizable.The same with the blue-white-red lights on a police car and the sirens.
A nurse’s uniform tells you that this is probably a nurse, even in contexts where the scrubs are not useful. A monk’s or priest’s robes tell you that this is a religious person who might give you religious advice. The act of picking a uniform for a group lets you begin to associate some properties of that group with the people in it, at a glance.
I think Tiiba2 perfectly addressed this with
It helps to have read An Intuitive Explanation of Bayes’ Theorem, but the short of it is this: The majority are not in cults. The minority are in cults. The minority of non-cults may wear uniforms, and the majority of cults may wear uniforms. The majority of the minority is not necessarily greater than the minority of the majority. So taking uniforms to mean cults is kind of intuitive, but not necessarily true.
If, for instance, your stamp collecting club decides they should all wear matching t-shirts at their meetings, it doesn’t mean they’ve crossed the line into becoming a cult, just that they want to wear matching t-shirts.
It is possible that wearing uniforms not only is evidence that your group is a cult (though it might be weak evidence, as you say) but also may contribute to your group becoming a cult. I can think of at least three somewhat plausible mechanisms. (1) Having a uniform may attract people who want to be in a cult and/or scare off people who very much want not to be in one. (2) Having a uniform may foster a sense of unity and conformity that makes cultishness come more naturally. (3) Having agreed to do something silly (like wearing a uniform) may put you in a frame of mind where you’re more likely to agree to other silly things the leader of the group asks you to do later.
Why are uniforms necessarily silly? Let’s take military dress uniforms. In the US, you can tell a military member’s rank and branch of service, and even get an idea of their service record, just by looking at their dress uniform. To insiders, this can be rapidly gleaned looking at someone from across a room. With millions of members, individuals cannot possibly be expected to know everybody else and so the uniform serves a useful function.
Wearing a uniform is not always silly; as you say, sometimes there are compelling reasons for it. However, sometimes there are no such compelling reasons, and in that case wearing a uniform is (at least prima facie) pointless. In the scenario under discussion, no reason for wearing a uniform is provided (or apparent) other than “the leader says we have to”.
If you want the group to acquire a collective reputation among other people, a uniform is useful. If Boy Scouts never chose a uniform, it would have been very hard for them to get their reputation for above-average conscientiousness and obedience to authority.
If you want to get a reputation as being good at solving problems (which Ougi’s group may), it is useful to have a shared appearance.
Especially the second one.
Eh, more the first than the second. Obedience to authority is something you can demonstrate by showing up and obeying; conscientiousness is mostly demonstrated when you do things while no one is watching and they are the things you’d do if someone was watching.
Do things while you believe falsely that no one is watching. Otherwise it’s impossible to prove conscientiousness.
Though, since beliefs aren’t externally apparent… it gets complicated quickly.