I think that the tradeoff in terms of getting feedback and providing something for others to build on, especially others outside of the narrow EA-motivated community, is often worthwhile.
This should be obvious for everyone! As an outside observer and huge sympathizer, it is super-frustrating how siloed the broad EA/rational/AI-alignment/adjacent community is—this specific issue with publication is only one of the consequences. Many of “you people” only interacting between “yourselves” (and I’m not referring to you, Davids), very often even socially. I mean, you guys are trying to do the most good possible, so help others use and leverage on your work! And don’t waste time reinventing what is already common or, at least, what already exists outside. More mixing would also help prevent Leverage-style failures and probably improve what from the outside seems like a very weird and unhealthy “bay area social dynamics” (as put by Kaj here).
I hope you don’t mind if I pop in here. I’ve been following this conversation with considerable interest. I too am an outsider. I’ve been peeking in every now and then for years, but started posting here almost a year ago, more or less, to test the waters. Anyhow, you say:
This should be obvious for everyone! As an outside observer and huge sympathizer, it is super-frustrating how siloed the broad EA/rational/AI-alignment/adjacent community is—this specific issue with publication is only one of the consequences.
Yes! And as you go on to say, it works in both directions too (”...don’t waste time reinventing what is already common...”). There’s breath-taking ignorance of existing work in relevant fields.
For example, around the corner there’s some interesting discussions under the heading of “semiotic physics,” which, as far as I can tell, is the application of complex dynamics to understanding LLMs. Super-important, super-interesting, even to someone like me, who can’t do the math. But the conversations proceed as though no one had ever thought of doing this, which simply is not true. And as far as I can tell, there’s no intention of trying to take this work to the outside world, which is a mistake.
At times it seems like this place is populated by people who think they’re the smartest one in the room, and maybe they were at one time, back in secondary school. But it’s a large world and there are lots of “smartest in the room” people in it. You need to get over it.
This should be obvious for everyone! As an outside observer and huge sympathizer, it is super-frustrating how siloed the broad EA/rational/AI-alignment/adjacent community is—this specific issue with publication is only one of the consequences. Many of “you people” only interacting between “yourselves” (and I’m not referring to you, Davids), very often even socially. I mean, you guys are trying to do the most good possible, so help others use and leverage on your work! And don’t waste time reinventing what is already common or, at least, what already exists outside. More mixing would also help prevent Leverage-style failures and probably improve what from the outside seems like a very weird and unhealthy “bay area social dynamics” (as put by Kaj here).
I hope you don’t mind if I pop in here. I’ve been following this conversation with considerable interest. I too am an outsider. I’ve been peeking in every now and then for years, but started posting here almost a year ago, more or less, to test the waters. Anyhow, you say:
Yes! And as you go on to say, it works in both directions too (”...don’t waste time reinventing what is already common...”). There’s breath-taking ignorance of existing work in relevant fields.
For example, around the corner there’s some interesting discussions under the heading of “semiotic physics,” which, as far as I can tell, is the application of complex dynamics to understanding LLMs. Super-important, super-interesting, even to someone like me, who can’t do the math. But the conversations proceed as though no one had ever thought of doing this, which simply is not true. And as far as I can tell, there’s no intention of trying to take this work to the outside world, which is a mistake.
At times it seems like this place is populated by people who think they’re the smartest one in the room, and maybe they were at one time, back in secondary school. But it’s a large world and there are lots of “smartest in the room” people in it. You need to get over it.
It’s a waste of intelligence and creativity.
Thanks, agreed. And as an aside, I don’t think it’s entirely coincidental that neither of the people who agree with you are in the Bay.