The reason I like Athol Kay is that in my opinion he understands this part correctly: being a powerful man (Alpha) and being a good father (Beta) are orthogonal traits. Most people seem to believe that they are strongly correlated (halo effect) or anticorrelated (false dilemma). Many PUAs would suggest that the Beta traits (where you apparently excel) are somehow harmful for the Alpha behavior. Athol says otherwise; and unlike most PUAs, he is the one who has a family with kids, so I would trust his expertise on this.
Yes, the Bible quotes are about an Alpha behavior, and it is there because at the times the Bible was written, it was a common sense. (It was before feminism, which succeeded in throwing out the baby with the bath water, and labeling every male assertive behavior as evil.) But I doubt the Bible could be very useful in finding good messages of this kind. Not every message there is good; I assume you are not going to also study tips and tricks on killing your neighbors who don’t worship Yahweh properly. And to recognize a good message, you must already know it is good, so you are not actually getting new information, only a confirmation of something you already believe, and perhaps a nice rationalization.
I’m also not invalidating womans rights and equality.
That would be a false dilemma. Whether someone has a right to vote or study science, and what makes one instinctively sexually attracted, are two different things. Men’s sexual preferences didn’t change just because voting became universal; why should women’s?
In my opinion, the proper solution is a mix of responsibility and role-playing. The man should not be the weaker one in the relationship; this is where personal growth is necessary. But beyond that point, I think mere role-playing (rationally recognized by both parties as such) is enough to satisfy the emotional needs and trigger the attraction. Specifically: I have to recognize my boundaries and say a clear “no” when they are threatened. Also I have to make a decision when neither of us wants to. But in the everyday life, when we both want the same thing, I can just pretend it’s my unilateral decision, and my girlfriend can pretend to obey me. But if she disagrees, she just plainly says so, and I change “my decision” accordingly. The way the decision is role-played is not necessarily the way it was causally made.
There are two ways a woman can challenge this; and it is necessary to understand the difference. First, being challenged and responding appropriately is an integral part of playing the authority role. Sometimes the woman just says “how about [something that violates your rules]?” and you calmly say “no”; and it’s over. This is part of the game, a playful rebellion that by being properly handled confirms the roles. Women do this instinctively, without being aware at the moment what they do. You recognize it afterwards by them not minding being told “no”, and actually being happy about it. Or if you fail to react properly, you recognize it afterwards by them being frustrated despite getting what they claimed to want. (This is a completely different situation from when the woman really wants something. In a good relationship you will find a way to communicate the difference, for example she says something like “I am serious about this”.) -- Second, she may have learned some harmful memes or had a bad relationship before you, where any dominant behavior from you triggers a mindkilling reaction or a panic mode in her, however a lack of dominant behavior makes you unattractive. I don’t know what to do here; I would predict that this relationship doesn’t have a chance.
Whether someone has a right to vote or study science, and what makes one instinctively sexually attracted, are two different things. Men’s sexual preferences didn’t change just because voting became universal; why should women’s?
Obviously. But the zeitgeist seems to downplay this truth toward zero.
I will consider your role-playing advice. I’m not sure how to integrate this with honesty and clear communication. And integrated with real life it must be otherwise it will not work or risk become an isolated purpose (which will evolve out of existence). And there are parts that I can enhance to work.
The reason I like Athol Kay is that in my opinion he understands this part correctly: being a powerful man (Alpha) and being a good father (Beta) are orthogonal traits. Most people seem to believe that they are strongly correlated (halo effect) or anticorrelated (false dilemma). Many PUAs would suggest that the Beta traits (where you apparently excel) are somehow harmful for the Alpha behavior. Athol says otherwise; and unlike most PUAs, he is the one who has a family with kids, so I would trust his expertise on this.
Yes, the Bible quotes are about an Alpha behavior, and it is there because at the times the Bible was written, it was a common sense. (It was before feminism, which succeeded in throwing out the baby with the bath water, and labeling every male assertive behavior as evil.) But I doubt the Bible could be very useful in finding good messages of this kind. Not every message there is good; I assume you are not going to also study tips and tricks on killing your neighbors who don’t worship Yahweh properly. And to recognize a good message, you must already know it is good, so you are not actually getting new information, only a confirmation of something you already believe, and perhaps a nice rationalization.
That would be a false dilemma. Whether someone has a right to vote or study science, and what makes one instinctively sexually attracted, are two different things. Men’s sexual preferences didn’t change just because voting became universal; why should women’s?
In my opinion, the proper solution is a mix of responsibility and role-playing. The man should not be the weaker one in the relationship; this is where personal growth is necessary. But beyond that point, I think mere role-playing (rationally recognized by both parties as such) is enough to satisfy the emotional needs and trigger the attraction. Specifically: I have to recognize my boundaries and say a clear “no” when they are threatened. Also I have to make a decision when neither of us wants to. But in the everyday life, when we both want the same thing, I can just pretend it’s my unilateral decision, and my girlfriend can pretend to obey me. But if she disagrees, she just plainly says so, and I change “my decision” accordingly. The way the decision is role-played is not necessarily the way it was causally made.
There are two ways a woman can challenge this; and it is necessary to understand the difference. First, being challenged and responding appropriately is an integral part of playing the authority role. Sometimes the woman just says “how about [something that violates your rules]?” and you calmly say “no”; and it’s over. This is part of the game, a playful rebellion that by being properly handled confirms the roles. Women do this instinctively, without being aware at the moment what they do. You recognize it afterwards by them not minding being told “no”, and actually being happy about it. Or if you fail to react properly, you recognize it afterwards by them being frustrated despite getting what they claimed to want. (This is a completely different situation from when the woman really wants something. In a good relationship you will find a way to communicate the difference, for example she says something like “I am serious about this”.) -- Second, she may have learned some harmful memes or had a bad relationship before you, where any dominant behavior from you triggers a mindkilling reaction or a panic mode in her, however a lack of dominant behavior makes you unattractive. I don’t know what to do here; I would predict that this relationship doesn’t have a chance.
Obviously. But the zeitgeist seems to downplay this truth toward zero.
I will consider your role-playing advice. I’m not sure how to integrate this with honesty and clear communication. And integrated with real life it must be otherwise it will not work or risk become an isolated purpose (which will evolve out of existence). And there are parts that I can enhance to work.