GP didn’t mean wars in general (though they’re very often bad!), they were clearly referring to the Trump administration starting a massively costly war with unclear objectives and no realistic way to achieve the stated ones, tanking the global economy and triggering a likely famine a year down the line, right after cutting funding for many life-saving programs at USAID with the stated purpose of cutting spending.
In that context, “they might sometimes be necessary” and “any successes are not also your successes” are not going to ever be relevant.
Fair, but in general the US have been waging random wars for a long time now and this argument is one I’ve seen used often (and to be clear I think most of the wars I’ve been alive to see were also bad). It’s just that now, specifically, it’s especially egregious. Even if we conceded that taking Iran’s nuclear ambitions down a peg was absolutely critical and that acting with force right now was the only way to achieve that (debatable), obviously the means of acting are ridiculously ineffectual, messy and incompetent.
, they were clearly referring to the Trump administration starting a massively costly war with unclear objectives and no realistic way to achieve the stated ones
I think it applies cleanly to every U.S. intervention and proxy war in the past four decades—not singling out one issue. Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, and the list goes on. The proxy conflict in Eastern Europe seems popular on LW, but it is very unpopular with the core fighting-age male demographic that is meant to be most invested in a nation’s military success or failure.
Of course, the Iran war is terrible as well, but it’s one on a long list. None of the wars that Americans bleed and pay for are in the interest of America, and most are to its outright detriment. This isn’t an isolated or partisan issue.
The proxy conflict in Eastern Europe seems popular on LW, but it is very unpopular with the core fighting-age male demographic that is meant to be most invested in a nation’s military success or failure.
I would maybe not lump together “propping up a country defending itself from an aggression by a different superpower” with all the shit that the US started on its own, often based on questionable if not outright false assumptions.
Let’s not use polite euphemisms here.
GP didn’t mean wars in general (though they’re very often bad!), they were clearly referring to the Trump administration starting a massively costly war with unclear objectives and no realistic way to achieve the stated ones, tanking the global economy and triggering a likely famine a year down the line, right after cutting funding for many life-saving programs at USAID with the stated purpose of cutting spending.
In that context, “they might sometimes be necessary” and “any successes are not also your successes” are not going to ever be relevant.
Fair, but in general the US have been waging random wars for a long time now and this argument is one I’ve seen used often (and to be clear I think most of the wars I’ve been alive to see were also bad). It’s just that now, specifically, it’s especially egregious. Even if we conceded that taking Iran’s nuclear ambitions down a peg was absolutely critical and that acting with force right now was the only way to achieve that (debatable), obviously the means of acting are ridiculously ineffectual, messy and incompetent.
Exactly.
I think it applies cleanly to every U.S. intervention and proxy war in the past four decades—not singling out one issue. Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, and the list goes on. The proxy conflict in Eastern Europe seems popular on LW, but it is very unpopular with the core fighting-age male demographic that is meant to be most invested in a nation’s military success or failure.
Of course, the Iran war is terrible as well, but it’s one on a long list. None of the wars that Americans bleed and pay for are in the interest of America, and most are to its outright detriment. This isn’t an isolated or partisan issue.
I would maybe not lump together “propping up a country defending itself from an aggression by a different superpower” with all the shit that the US started on its own, often based on questionable if not outright false assumptions.