I don’t have a worked out opinion on the effectiveness of hunger strikes on this issue and at this point of AI capabilities progress. On the one hand the strikes outside Anthropic and DeepMind have driven some good coverage. On the other hand the comments on X and reddit are mostly pretty dire; the hunger strikes may unfortunately have reinforced in people’s mind that this is a very fringe issue for loonies. My best guess is that the hunger strikes outside Anthropic and DeepMind are net positive.
Your other points:
Nice that you have a concrete demand.
I’m not saying I would rather you hide additional reasons. I’m just saying a hunger strike is probably less effective if you announce you’re also doing it for the lolz.
I wasn’t objecting to you streaming it on your channel, but pointing to your channel as a good place to “learn more”. That’s the bit that looks more like self-promotion. I’m not making any claim as to your intentions, just what this might look like to someone who doesn’t care about or hasn’t heard about AI x-risk.
I’m also not suggesting you buy tickets to the US or UK for this. I’m just saying that not being physically in front of the institution you’re protesting against likely massively reduces your effectiveness, probably to the point where this is not worth your time will power. Anthropic cannot pretend to not have noticed Guido Reichstadter outside their office. They can easily pretend to not have noticed you (or actually not have noticed) you.
That said, I think some of the effectiveness of the strikes outside Anthropic and DeepMind comes not from changing people’s minds, but by showing others that yes, you can in fact demonstrate publicly against the current situation. This could be important to build up momentum ahead of time, before things get very out of hand later (if they do). Your hunger strike may contribute positively to that, although I think part of the value of their strikes is doing it in public, very visibly, because that takes tremendous bravery. Doing it outside a lab also puts pressure on the lab, because everyone can see you; and everyone knows that that the lab knows about you and is consciously choosing not to entertain your demand.
On the other hand the comments on X and reddit are mostly pretty dire; the hunger strikes may unfortunately have reinforced in people’s mind that this is a very fringe issue for loonies.
It is an extreme issue, and yes I am not surprised that many people are having this reaction.
Also X is full of bots, reddit too but a bit less so. I would rather trust the opinion of 10 people you ask in-person. I am playing the long game here, people can consider it fringe today and take it seriously a year later.
I’m just saying a hunger strike is probably less effective if you announce you’re also doing it for the lolz.
Probably? I don’t know I think emotional stances spread just as rational ones. My honest emotional stance is a mix of a lot of pain over the issue, plus just generally going on with normal social life and that gives me some happiness too. Is it better for the world if I’m more depressed? Less depressed? You can easily make a case either way for which emotional stance is actually required to go more viral. But I don’t want to play the game of pretending to be feeling things I’m not in order to become a leader.
probably to the point where this is not worth your time will power.
Suggest me more effective plans then. Actually backed by data, not just speculation.
That’s the bit that looks more like self-promotion. I’m not making any claim as to your intentions, just what this might look like to someone who doesn’t care about or hasn’t heard about AI x-risk.
Fair point, I’ll think about this. I do wonder if there’s a way to ensure the issue is popular, without having to figure out which person is trustworthy enough to be a leader for the issue. There is clearly scarcity of trust in the AI protest space which makes sense to me. Is there a way to make a website that collects upvotes for an AI pause, that is not also controlled by one of the (from your eyes, possibly untrustworthy) groups working on the issue?
In general my opinion of lesswrong is that a) it is full of thinkers not doers, and hence lots of people have opinions on right thing to do without actual data backing any of it up. I’m also somewhat of a thinker so I default to falling in this trap. b) it is full of people who want to secretly bring about the singularity for longtermist utilitarian reasons, and don’t want the public involved.
I don’t know you personally, so it’s possible you are not like this. I’m explaining why I don’t want to give people here a lot of chances to prove they’re speaking in good faith, or take their opinions too seriously etc
I don’t have a worked out opinion on the effectiveness of hunger strikes on this issue and at this point of AI capabilities progress. On the one hand the strikes outside Anthropic and DeepMind have driven some good coverage. On the other hand the comments on X and reddit are mostly pretty dire; the hunger strikes may unfortunately have reinforced in people’s mind that this is a very fringe issue for loonies. My best guess is that the hunger strikes outside Anthropic and DeepMind are net positive.
Your other points:
Nice that you have a concrete demand.
I’m not saying I would rather you hide additional reasons. I’m just saying a hunger strike is probably less effective if you announce you’re also doing it for the lolz.
I wasn’t objecting to you streaming it on your channel, but pointing to your channel as a good place to “learn more”. That’s the bit that looks more like self-promotion. I’m not making any claim as to your intentions, just what this might look like to someone who doesn’t care about or hasn’t heard about AI x-risk.
I’m also not suggesting you buy tickets to the US or UK for this. I’m just saying that not being physically in front of the institution you’re protesting against likely massively reduces your effectiveness, probably to the point where this is not worth your time will power. Anthropic cannot pretend to not have noticed Guido Reichstadter outside their office. They can easily pretend to not have noticed you (or actually not have noticed) you.
That said, I think some of the effectiveness of the strikes outside Anthropic and DeepMind comes not from changing people’s minds, but by showing others that yes, you can in fact demonstrate publicly against the current situation. This could be important to build up momentum ahead of time, before things get very out of hand later (if they do). Your hunger strike may contribute positively to that, although I think part of the value of their strikes is doing it in public, very visibly, because that takes tremendous bravery. Doing it outside a lab also puts pressure on the lab, because everyone can see you; and everyone knows that that the lab knows about you and is consciously choosing not to entertain your demand.
It is an extreme issue, and yes I am not surprised that many people are having this reaction.
Also X is full of bots, reddit too but a bit less so. I would rather trust the opinion of 10 people you ask in-person. I am playing the long game here, people can consider it fringe today and take it seriously a year later.
Probably? I don’t know I think emotional stances spread just as rational ones. My honest emotional stance is a mix of a lot of pain over the issue, plus just generally going on with normal social life and that gives me some happiness too. Is it better for the world if I’m more depressed? Less depressed? You can easily make a case either way for which emotional stance is actually required to go more viral. But I don’t want to play the game of pretending to be feeling things I’m not in order to become a leader.
Suggest me more effective plans then. Actually backed by data, not just speculation.
Fair point, I’ll think about this. I do wonder if there’s a way to ensure the issue is popular, without having to figure out which person is trustworthy enough to be a leader for the issue. There is clearly scarcity of trust in the AI protest space which makes sense to me. Is there a way to make a website that collects upvotes for an AI pause, that is not also controlled by one of the (from your eyes, possibly untrustworthy) groups working on the issue?
In general my opinion of lesswrong is that a) it is full of thinkers not doers, and hence lots of people have opinions on right thing to do without actual data backing any of it up. I’m also somewhat of a thinker so I default to falling in this trap. b) it is full of people who want to secretly bring about the singularity for longtermist utilitarian reasons, and don’t want the public involved.
I don’t know you personally, so it’s possible you are not like this. I’m explaining why I don’t want to give people here a lot of chances to prove they’re speaking in good faith, or take their opinions too seriously etc