Sorry, that was awfully vague. I’m probably referring to younger kids than you are. Although there’s also going to be a lot of variance in when kids develop different introspective skills and conceptual understanding of their own minds.
I agree that not knowing you have a mind doesn’t prevent you from having an experience. What I meant was that at some young age, I’m thinking up to age five but even 5-year-olds could be more advanced, a kid will not be able to conceptualize that they are a mind or alternately phrased that they have a mind. Nonetheless, they are a mind that is doing a bunch of complex processing and remembering some of it.
I definitely agree that phenomenal consciousness and intelligence are different. Discussions of consciousness usually break down in difficulties with terminology and how to communicate about different aspects of consciousness. I haven’t come up with good ways to talk about this stuff.
I guess I felt the need to comment because I don’t even remember a time where that description would’ve been accurate for me—but wouldn’t be surprising if this also had something to do with memory formation so I can’t make too much of that. And notably, while I don’t recognize any point of my past kid self from that description, it’s indeed starting only around the age of 5 where I feel very confident about it. Curious if anyone here remembers relatively clearly something like “having experiences while lacking awareness of having a mind”.
Sorry, that was awfully vague. I’m probably referring to younger kids than you are. Although there’s also going to be a lot of variance in when kids develop different introspective skills and conceptual understanding of their own minds.
I agree that not knowing you have a mind doesn’t prevent you from having an experience. What I meant was that at some young age, I’m thinking up to age five but even 5-year-olds could be more advanced, a kid will not be able to conceptualize that they are a mind or alternately phrased that they have a mind. Nonetheless, they are a mind that is doing a bunch of complex processing and remembering some of it.
I definitely agree that phenomenal consciousness and intelligence are different. Discussions of consciousness usually break down in difficulties with terminology and how to communicate about different aspects of consciousness. I haven’t come up with good ways to talk about this stuff.
I guess I felt the need to comment because I don’t even remember a time where that description would’ve been accurate for me—but wouldn’t be surprising if this also had something to do with memory formation so I can’t make too much of that. And notably, while I don’t recognize any point of my past kid self from that description, it’s indeed starting only around the age of 5 where I feel very confident about it. Curious if anyone here remembers relatively clearly something like “having experiences while lacking awareness of having a mind”.