Yes, I agree, it’s usually bad when religions require that you believe specific, falsifiable claims to be part of them. Not all religions do, but many do, and the two most popular ones (Christianity and Islam) very much do. Sadly, requiring people to believe specific claims is probably why these religions spread so well: it makes it painful to leave the religion because everyone thinks you are doing something extremely dumb and possibly evil from their shared point of view.
For what it’s worth, this is one of the things I like about many forms of Buddhism, not just Zen. Aside form the Four Noble Truths there’s no creed or specific beliefs you’re expected to believe, and even then no one is actually checking that you really believe the Four Noble Truths (though if you don’t at least kind of believe them you’ll probably select yourself out). At many places all you have to do is show up and do it: sit meditation, participate in rituals, etc. As long as you believe you want to be part of a sangha (i.e. you want to select yourself into Buddhism) and you aren’t being a jerk, you can be part of a sangha.
I wonder if this is generally true or just the way Buddhism ends up manifesting in the west, where it’s mostly for the sake of educated people pursuing meditation and alternative spirituality.
Historically, Buddhism could well be very playing a similar role for social cohesion and political legitimacy as Christianity or Islam. Mahayana Buddhism has plenty of “saints” and their cults in the Bodhisattvas, Tibet was a theocratic monarchy, etc.
Very true. We’re in the process of creating Western Buddhism, and probably have another couple hundred years (if we didn’t have to think about AI) before it’s fully formed. You’re right that Eastern Buddhisms contain a lot more traditional religious expression that’s missing form the West, although I think part of why Zen in particular became popular is because it’s a strain of Buddhism that is especially amenable to post-Enlightenment European values (I occasionally make the analogy that Zen is roughly the Reformed sect of Buddhism (it feels in particular very Presbyterian to me), and it was arguably the Reform movement that laid last pieces of the necessary memetic groundwork for the European Enlightenment to happen).
Yes, I agree, it’s usually bad when religions require that you believe specific, falsifiable claims to be part of them. Not all religions do, but many do, and the two most popular ones (Christianity and Islam) very much do. Sadly, requiring people to believe specific claims is probably why these religions spread so well: it makes it painful to leave the religion because everyone thinks you are doing something extremely dumb and possibly evil from their shared point of view.
For what it’s worth, this is one of the things I like about many forms of Buddhism, not just Zen. Aside form the Four Noble Truths there’s no creed or specific beliefs you’re expected to believe, and even then no one is actually checking that you really believe the Four Noble Truths (though if you don’t at least kind of believe them you’ll probably select yourself out). At many places all you have to do is show up and do it: sit meditation, participate in rituals, etc. As long as you believe you want to be part of a sangha (i.e. you want to select yourself into Buddhism) and you aren’t being a jerk, you can be part of a sangha.
I wonder if this is generally true or just the way Buddhism ends up manifesting in the west, where it’s mostly for the sake of educated people pursuing meditation and alternative spirituality.
Historically, Buddhism could well be very playing a similar role for social cohesion and political legitimacy as Christianity or Islam. Mahayana Buddhism has plenty of “saints” and their cults in the Bodhisattvas, Tibet was a theocratic monarchy, etc.
Very true. We’re in the process of creating Western Buddhism, and probably have another couple hundred years (if we didn’t have to think about AI) before it’s fully formed. You’re right that Eastern Buddhisms contain a lot more traditional religious expression that’s missing form the West, although I think part of why Zen in particular became popular is because it’s a strain of Buddhism that is especially amenable to post-Enlightenment European values (I occasionally make the analogy that Zen is roughly the Reformed sect of Buddhism (it feels in particular very Presbyterian to me), and it was arguably the Reform movement that laid last pieces of the necessary memetic groundwork for the European Enlightenment to happen).