I think this is one case where language is a bit inadequate.
I think it is very possible for “suffering” to be good. There are two cases for this:
“suffering” in which states are described as negative, but which are still positive valence. One example of this is the burn one feels from spicy food. This still feels good and is pleasurable, despite nominally having aspects which are described as bad. Some similar things are when crying feels cathartic. Or people who gain direct pleasure from painful stimuli. Often there is a limit to how far one can go before the direct pain stops feeling directly pleasurable, but there is a lot of variation in the human mind, and some people gain mental pleasure from being able to withstand levels of pain that are considered unbearable. This can be due to to things like feelings of pride, or servitude, or novelty.
“suffering” in which one was actually in pain/suffering at the time of the even, but which leads one to better mental states after the fact. Perhaps it leads one to grow and fix one’s other problems. Perhaps it is a memorable experience one finds valuable.
I have experienced both. Suffering can be a way to describe this, if the experience is also either positive-valence, or leading to longer-term pleasure, then I’m not sure it counts.
I think there are some forms of suffering that are near universally felt as bad. This can be chronic pain one gets from illness, or the suffering one can feel when feverish, scenarios of starvation or hunger, or through effective torture. And I guess with “suffering is bad” I am trying to point more-so at this.
I respond to you in my next post but i’m also copying here:
I think this is one case where language is a bit inadequate.
I think it is very possible for “suffering” to be good. There are two cases for this:
“suffering” in which states are described as negative, but which are still positive valence. One example of this is the burn one feels from spicy food. This still feels good and is pleasurable, despite nominally having aspects which are described as bad. Some similar things are when crying feels cathartic. Or people who gain direct pleasure from painful stimuli. Often there is a limit to how far one can go before the direct pain stops feeling directly pleasurable, but there is a lot of variation in the human mind, and some people gain mental pleasure from being able to withstand levels of pain that are considered unbearable. This can be due to to things like feelings of pride, or servitude, or novelty.
“suffering” in which one was actually in pain/suffering at the time of the even, but which leads one to better mental states after the fact. Perhaps it leads one to grow and fix one’s other problems. Perhaps it is a memorable experience one finds valuable.
I have experienced both. Suffering can be a way to describe this, if the experience is also either positive-valence, or leading to longer-term pleasure, then I’m not sure it counts.
I think there are some forms of suffering that are near universally felt as bad. This can be chronic pain one gets from illness, or the suffering one can feel when feverish, scenarios of starvation or hunger, or through effective torture. And I guess with “suffering is bad” I am trying to point more-so at this.