You can say even when neither of them can compare the descriptions it still means their descriptions are the same. But from what perspective is this statement made? It is from a god’s eye view that directly thinks in terms of reality.
A self-consistent theory only means from any perspective, analyzing the interactions affected by an object cannot give conflicting descriptions of said object. If the only interaction upon you from the camera is an infra-red photo of the bottle, and from your direct interaction with the bottle you concluded it’s red, and from the infra-red photo you concluded it is green, then there’s something wrong with your theory that needs rectifying.
Besides, applying the same theories from the cameras’ perspective does not necessarily mean an infrared camera and a normal camera would give different (macro-scale) descriptions of the bottle. Sure the cameras give different photos. But the interactions they receive from the bottle are not that different. The infrared camera still gets bombarded by photons of all energy levels. They don’t just pass through the camera unaffected without interacting with it. And physical descriptions are based on them. If instead there is an infrared camera that let photons of higher energy levels pass through without interacting, as if they don’t exist to the camera, then it would give different descriptions.
Look, what I am arguing is that a foundational “absolute reality” is an additional assumption based on our intuition formed in the daily environment. Thinking directly in terms of this absolute reality is problematic outside of our intuitive environment, e.g. high speed or microscopic so we should get rid of this assumption however convenient it proved to be in the past.
I remembered Thomas Nagel said we get the idea of scientific objectivity through 3 steps.
Realize (or postulate) that my experiences are caused by actions upon me from the environment.
Realize (or postulate) that what causes actions upon me can also act on other things. They can exist on their own.
Realize (or postulate) an “true nature” that is independent of any perspective.
People in general regard science as the study of this “true nature” using “a view from nowhere”. I am simply arguing Postulate 3 is taking it too far.
Postulate 1 expands the scope from subjective experiences to actions, i.e. subjective experiences are not special. Postulate 2 expands the scope from my first-person perspective to anything’s perspective, i.e. my perspective is not special. Using only these two is not only more parsimonious, it also fits very well with the increasingly observer/perspective-dependent trend of physical discoveries.
You can say even when neither of them can compare the descriptions it still means their descriptions are the same. But from what perspective is this statement made? It is from a god’s eye view that directly thinks in terms of reality.
A self-consistent theory only means from any perspective, analyzing the interactions affected by an object cannot give conflicting descriptions of said object. If the only interaction upon you from the camera is an infra-red photo of the bottle, and from your direct interaction with the bottle you concluded it’s red, and from the infra-red photo you concluded it is green, then there’s something wrong with your theory that needs rectifying.
Besides, applying the same theories from the cameras’ perspective does not necessarily mean an infrared camera and a normal camera would give different (macro-scale) descriptions of the bottle. Sure the cameras give different photos. But the interactions they receive from the bottle are not that different. The infrared camera still gets bombarded by photons of all energy levels. They don’t just pass through the camera unaffected without interacting with it. And physical descriptions are based on them. If instead there is an infrared camera that let photons of higher energy levels pass through without interacting, as if they don’t exist to the camera, then it would give different descriptions.
Look, what I am arguing is that a foundational “absolute reality” is an additional assumption based on our intuition formed in the daily environment. Thinking directly in terms of this absolute reality is problematic outside of our intuitive environment, e.g. high speed or microscopic so we should get rid of this assumption however convenient it proved to be in the past.
I remembered Thomas Nagel said we get the idea of scientific objectivity through 3 steps.
Realize (or postulate) that my experiences are caused by actions upon me from the environment.
Realize (or postulate) that what causes actions upon me can also act on other things. They can exist on their own.
Realize (or postulate) an “true nature” that is independent of any perspective.
People in general regard science as the study of this “true nature” using “a view from nowhere”. I am simply arguing Postulate 3 is taking it too far.
Postulate 1 expands the scope from subjective experiences to actions, i.e. subjective experiences are not special. Postulate 2 expands the scope from my first-person perspective to anything’s perspective, i.e. my perspective is not special. Using only these two is not only more parsimonious, it also fits very well with the increasingly observer/perspective-dependent trend of physical discoveries.
Okay, I disagree :-)