I had just recently seen the two Christopher Nolan Batman movies (Batman Begins and The Dark Knight). Here are my favorite quotes; please add any that you like. (Character attribution left off to prevent pre-judgment.) Wikiquotelists.
“It’s not who you are on the inside; it’s what you do that defines you.” (Compare: Functionalism, substrate independence, timeless identity – I know, that’s probably not what was intended, but note how it’s used in other contexts.)
“Criminals thrive on the indulgence of society’s understanding.” (Compare to counterfactual reasoning: if we would sympathize with every defection, and felt that “the past is the past”, those wishing to defect would have no reason not to.)
“And what about escalation? […] We start carrying semi-automatics, they buy automatics. We start wearing Kevlar, they buy armor-piercing rounds. […] And you’re wearing a mask, and jumping off rooftops!”
(Also, I watched the earlier Batman movies after seeing this, and frankly, by comparison, they look like campy garbage.)
“Criminals thrive on the indulgence of society’s understanding.” (Compare to counterfactual reasoning: if we would sympathize with every defection, and felt that “the past is the past”, those wishing to defect would have no reason not to.)
It’s a complicated issue—as nearly as I can tell, the people who argue for no understanding assume that they can just use their intuitions about punishment, and not update about whether they’re getting the effects they want.
I agree. I wasn’t trying to argue in favor of some kind of unlimited punishment, or against all understanding whatsoever—just that this kind of understanding can be misused, especially when you discount the offense for being in the past. (I had recently read Drescher’s account in Good and Real of why the pastward, inalterable aspect of a transgression, and the fact that the punishment only causes things in the future, are no reason not to punish.)
Edit3: And, of course [rot13] vg jnf n onq thl jub fnvq gung va gur zbivr, naq gur guvatf lbh jnea nobhg ner unaqyrq va gur zbivr, nf gung punenpgre’f ernfbavat yrnqf uvz gb qb ubeevoyr guvatf ba gung onfvf, yvxr gel gb qrfgebl na ragver pvgl. Ng gur fnzr gvzr, V guvax ur qbrf unir n cbvag.
I had just recently seen the two Christopher Nolan Batman movies (Batman Begins and The Dark Knight). Here are my favorite quotes; please add any that you like. (Character attribution left off to prevent pre-judgment.) Wikiquote lists.
“It’s not who you are on the inside; it’s what you do that defines you.” (Compare: Functionalism, substrate independence, timeless identity – I know, that’s probably not what was intended, but note how it’s used in other contexts.)
“Criminals thrive on the indulgence of society’s understanding.” (Compare to counterfactual reasoning: if we would sympathize with every defection, and felt that “the past is the past”, those wishing to defect would have no reason not to.)
“And what about escalation? […] We start carrying semi-automatics, they buy automatics. We start wearing Kevlar, they buy armor-piercing rounds. […] And you’re wearing a mask, and jumping off rooftops!”
(Also, I watched the earlier Batman movies after seeing this, and frankly, by comparison, they look like campy garbage.)
Nolan’s Memento is also interesting from a rationalist perspective—it gives “running on untrusted hardware” a quite concrete meaning.
It’s a complicated issue—as nearly as I can tell, the people who argue for no understanding assume that they can just use their intuitions about punishment, and not update about whether they’re getting the effects they want.
I agree. I wasn’t trying to argue in favor of some kind of unlimited punishment, or against all understanding whatsoever—just that this kind of understanding can be misused, especially when you discount the offense for being in the past. (I had recently read Drescher’s account in Good and Real of why the pastward, inalterable aspect of a transgression, and the fact that the punishment only causes things in the future, are no reason not to punish.)
Edit3: And, of course [rot13] vg jnf n onq thl jub fnvq gung va gur zbivr, naq gur guvatf lbh jnea nobhg ner unaqyrq va gur zbivr, nf gung punenpgre’f ernfbavat yrnqf uvz gb qb ubeevoyr guvatf ba gung onfvf, yvxr gel gb qrfgebl na ragver pvgl. Ng gur fnzr gvzr, V guvax ur qbrf unir n cbvag.