Spend ~5 minutes on the r/exmormon or r/exmuslim subreddits, and you’ll find most people leaving those religions consider them cults. Spend ~5 hours in a Mormon church or Muslim mosque, and most people not born into those religions will consider them cults. My guess is:
You only have an outside perspective on Mormons/Muslims. You don’t understand why they do what they do, or why they believe what they do, but the actions you do see seem mostly fine. Maybe a few quirks here and there, but they’re mostly happy, good people.
Also, you’re working under a different definition of cult. Which is strange, because even according to your definition, Mormons/Muslims should be more culty than other groups, which means you should probably trust their understanding of what constitutes a cult better than your own.
If your argument is, “from an inside perspective, Rationalism doesn’t seem like a cult,” then you’re proving way too much. From an inside perspective, every Mormon believes they are not part of a cult:
Absolute authoritarianism without accountability? No, we have votes of confidence every year and can tell our leaders privately when we have problems.
Zero tolerance for criticism or questions? We love asking questions. We even have a guide for our youth to ask questions and come up with their own answers.
Lack of meaningful financial disclosure regarding budget? Okay, we haven’t always been great about this, but it’s because we were embarrassingly in debt for ~50 years. We do at least have an internal audit every year to confirm things look good, and we disclose how much we donate.
Unreasonable fears about the outside world that often involve evil conspiracies and persecutions? Our fears aren’t unreasonable. Just look at the Missouri Extermination Order, or the Utah War. People outside of our community have, historically, been out to get us, and using the powers of the state to systematically dismantle our religion. Things have certainly calmed down in the last 100 years, and with a 90% representation in our state of Deseret Utah we don’t really fear the government so much, but there’s still lots of people out there trying to trick us into leaving the religion. Just look at how many people get led astray every year and fall away from The Church™
A belief that former followers are always wrong for leaving and there is never a legitimate reason for anyone else to leave? Um… yeah? That’s because we have the truth. If it’s true, you shouldn’t have a legitimate reason to leave. Every other religion believes this too, even those queer woke scientists, they’re just less willing to proclaim it to the world. Probably because they only have a part of the truth.
Abuse of members? We don’t want abuse any more than any other group, and we do much better than the general population.
Records, books, articles, or programs documenting the abuses of the leader or group? Maybe way back in the 1850s there was some questionable history, but (1) things were different back then, and (2) we’re different now. If we judged every group older than a hundred years through a presentist lens, every group would fail the test.
Followers feeling they are never able to be “good enough”? Everyone knows we’re imperfect, but that’s the beauty of Jesus’ Atonement. Honestly, I’d be scared of an ideology that teaches its members they are “good enough” or they can do no wrong. Look at how kids coming out of that parenting environment end up: belligerent, stupid, addicted to drugs, and living in their parents’ basement at thirty.
A belief that the leader is right at all times? Definitely not true. We acknowledge all the time that prophets have made mistakes (in both the Old Testament and modern times). Now, it may take a few decades to figure out when they’re making a mistake, so we usually assume the current leader is speaking-as-god-not-as-a-man, but there are plenty of weirdos even within the church who are willing to contradict the prophets.
A belief that the leader is the exclusive means of knowing “truth” or giving validation? Nah, we can all get personal revelation.
I think you could argue that Mormonism fits maybe one or two of these cult warning signs, but I’m pretty sure every group hits one or two. Heck, your company probably hits more than Mormonism.
Spend ~5 minutes on the r/exmormon or r/exmuslim subreddits, and you’ll find most people leaving those religions consider them cults. Spend ~5 hours in a Mormon church or Muslim mosque, and most people not born into those religions will consider them cults. My guess is:
You only have an outside perspective on Mormons/Muslims. You don’t understand why they do what they do, or why they believe what they do, but the actions you do see seem mostly fine. Maybe a few quirks here and there, but they’re mostly happy, good people.
Also, you’re working under a different definition of cult. Which is strange, because even according to your definition, Mormons/Muslims should be more culty than other groups, which means you should probably trust their understanding of what constitutes a cult better than your own.
If your argument is, “from an inside perspective, Rationalism doesn’t seem like a cult,” then you’re proving way too much. From an inside perspective, every Mormon believes they are not part of a cult:
Absolute authoritarianism without accountability? No, we have votes of confidence every year and can tell our leaders privately when we have problems.
Zero tolerance for criticism or questions? We love asking questions. We even have a guide for our youth to ask questions and come up with their own answers.
Lack of meaningful financial disclosure regarding budget? Okay, we haven’t always been great about this, but it’s because we were embarrassingly in debt for ~50 years. We do at least have an internal audit every year to confirm things look good, and we disclose how much we donate.
Unreasonable fears about the outside world that often involve evil conspiracies and persecutions? Our fears aren’t unreasonable. Just look at the Missouri Extermination Order, or the Utah War. People outside of our community have, historically, been out to get us, and using the powers of the state to systematically dismantle our religion. Things have certainly calmed down in the last 100 years, and with a 90% representation in our state of
DeseretUtah we don’t really fear the government so much, but there’s still lots of people out there trying to trick us into leaving the religion. Just look at how many people get led astray every year and fall away from The Church™A belief that former followers are always wrong for leaving and there is never a legitimate reason for anyone else to leave? Um… yeah? That’s because we have the truth. If it’s true, you shouldn’t have a legitimate reason to leave. Every other religion believes this too, even those queer woke scientists, they’re just less willing to proclaim it to the world. Probably because they only have a part of the truth.
Abuse of members? We don’t want abuse any more than any other group, and we do much better than the general population.
Records, books, articles, or programs documenting the abuses of the leader or group? Maybe way back in the 1850s there was some questionable history, but (1) things were different back then, and (2) we’re different now. If we judged every group older than a hundred years through a presentist lens, every group would fail the test.
Followers feeling they are never able to be “good enough”? Everyone knows we’re imperfect, but that’s the beauty of Jesus’ Atonement. Honestly, I’d be scared of an ideology that teaches its members they are “good enough” or they can do no wrong. Look at how kids coming out of that parenting environment end up: belligerent, stupid, addicted to drugs, and living in their parents’ basement at thirty.
A belief that the leader is right at all times? Definitely not true. We acknowledge all the time that prophets have made mistakes (in both the Old Testament and modern times). Now, it may take a few decades to figure out when they’re making a mistake, so we usually assume the current leader is speaking-as-god-not-as-a-man, but there are plenty of weirdos even within the church who are willing to contradict the prophets.
A belief that the leader is the exclusive means of knowing “truth” or giving validation? Nah, we can all get personal revelation.
I think you could argue that Mormonism fits maybe one or two of these cult warning signs, but I’m pretty sure every group hits one or two. Heck, your company probably hits more than Mormonism.