The example of Athens vs. Sparta is our best datapoint: It pitted the ancient world’s most rational society against the ancient world’s greatest warrior society, well-controlled in terms of wealth, technology, geography, and genetics. Their war was evenly matched, but Sparta won in the end.
Sparta was 1⁄3 the size of Athens+Attica (100,000 vs. 300,000), with only 1⁄5 as many citizens (8,000 vs 40,000).
Not a very good data point. Athens at that time was not a community of rationalists. Xenophon’s March of the 10000) or Thucydides History of the Peloponesian War are both fairly readable classical sources for the extreme stupidity (even by modern democratic standards) of the Athenian democratic process. And their army voted for autocratic undercommanders who then had life and death power over the troops. The distant Athenian democracy voted for autocratic overcommanders.
I didn’t say it was very good. I said it was our best. The world has never had a country of rationalists.
If the point of the original post was that a society of inhumanly-rational people can win wars, then it’s of limited applicability at present. I’m assuming that we’re talking about IQ 100 Bayesians. (Which may be an empty set.)
The example of Athens vs. Sparta is our best datapoint: It pitted the ancient world’s most rational society against the ancient world’s greatest warrior society, well-controlled in terms of wealth, technology, geography, and genetics. Their war was evenly matched, but Sparta won in the end.
Sparta was 1⁄3 the size of Athens+Attica (100,000 vs. 300,000), with only 1⁄5 as many citizens (8,000 vs 40,000).
Not a very good data point. Athens at that time was not a community of rationalists. Xenophon’s March of the 10000) or Thucydides History of the Peloponesian War are both fairly readable classical sources for the extreme stupidity (even by modern democratic standards) of the Athenian democratic process. And their army voted for autocratic undercommanders who then had life and death power over the troops. The distant Athenian democracy voted for autocratic overcommanders.
I didn’t say it was very good. I said it was our best. The world has never had a country of rationalists.
If the point of the original post was that a society of inhumanly-rational people can win wars, then it’s of limited applicability at present. I’m assuming that we’re talking about IQ 100 Bayesians. (Which may be an empty set.)