Your comment definitely pulls me in your direction.
This is hard and probably not fair to do without knowing what else is in “non-theism”. But in general theism has an advantage you’re forgetting which is that it lets us explain everything we don’t understand with magic. Big Bang, abiogenesis, what have you, theism has been defined in such a way that it can explain anything we can’t already explain. This means everything we don’t understand is evidence for God. I don’t know that the realization that we keep explaining things previously attributable to God swamps this effect. You’re certainly right that the image of God one arrives at is at best indifferent and at worst humorously sadistic (with “averse to science” somewhere in the middle).
I will say that I’m not sure Occam priors actually come from any kind of analytic deduction based on something like algorithmic complexity. That is, I think the whole thing might just be one giant meta-induction on all our confirmed and falsified hypotheses where simplicity turned out to be a useful heuristic. In which case, I don’t know what the prior was (doesn’t matter) but p=God is just crazy low,
That’s not necessarily true. You could have a shy god. The better your epistemology gets, the shyer it gets, always staying on the edge of humanity’s epistemology. But it still works miracles when people aren’t looking too closely.
Though I’m not quite sure what kind of god you’re talking about in your comment; it seems weird to me to ignore the only kind of god that seems particularly likely, i.e. a simulator god/pantheon.
Though I’m not quite sure what kind of god you’re talking about in your comment; it seems weird to me to ignore the only kind of god that seems particularly likely, i.e. a simulator god/pantheon.
But in general theism has an advantage you’re forgetting which is that it lets us explain everything we don’t understand with magic.
If “magic” is the answer to anything we don’t understand, then it isn’t an explanation, it’s just an abbreviation for “I don’t know”. This is hardly an advantage.
Big Bang, abiogenesis, what have you, theism has been defined in such a way that it can explain anything we can’t already explain. This means everything we don’t understand is evidence for God.
If theism can explain anything, it explains nothing. Phlogiston anyone?
I’m not assuming you are arguing for theism. What I assume you’re arguing for is that theism being able to “explain” anything is an advantage for theism, which it is not. I’m not arguing against theism either.
I see what you mean, but how does theism “explaining” currently unsolved mysteries in any way constrain experience? As far as I know, theism postulating “all was created by a god” doesn’t allow me to anticipate anything I can’t already anticipate anyway. Also as far as I know, it’s not as if any phenomena currently not explainable were predicted by any form of theism.
I may be wrong on this though, as I am certainly not a theism expert. If so, this would be actual evidence for theism.
Your comment definitely pulls me in your direction.
This is hard and probably not fair to do without knowing what else is in “non-theism”. But in general theism has an advantage you’re forgetting which is that it lets us explain everything we don’t understand with magic. Big Bang, abiogenesis, what have you, theism has been defined in such a way that it can explain anything we can’t already explain. This means everything we don’t understand is evidence for God. I don’t know that the realization that we keep explaining things previously attributable to God swamps this effect. You’re certainly right that the image of God one arrives at is at best indifferent and at worst humorously sadistic (with “averse to science” somewhere in the middle).
I will say that I’m not sure Occam priors actually come from any kind of analytic deduction based on something like algorithmic complexity. That is, I think the whole thing might just be one giant meta-induction on all our confirmed and falsified hypotheses where simplicity turned out to be a useful heuristic. In which case, I don’t know what the prior was (doesn’t matter) but p=God is just crazy low,
That’s not necessarily true. You could have a shy god. The better your epistemology gets, the shyer it gets, always staying on the edge of humanity’s epistemology. But it still works miracles when people aren’t looking too closely.
Though I’m not quite sure what kind of god you’re talking about in your comment; it seems weird to me to ignore the only kind of god that seems particularly likely, i.e. a simulator god/pantheon.
He used to be a shy god Until I made him my god Yeah
Shy is what I meant by “averse to science”.
Agreed.
If “magic” is the answer to anything we don’t understand, then it isn’t an explanation, it’s just an abbreviation for “I don’t know”. This is hardly an advantage.
If theism can explain anything, it explains nothing. Phlogiston anyone?
You need to read the thread instead of assuming l’m actually arguing for theism.
I’m not assuming you are arguing for theism. What I assume you’re arguing for is that theism being able to “explain” anything is an advantage for theism, which it is not. I’m not arguing against theism either.
I mainly meant any step on the causal path to our existence. Apologies.
I see what you mean, but how does theism “explaining” currently unsolved mysteries in any way constrain experience? As far as I know, theism postulating “all was created by a god” doesn’t allow me to anticipate anything I can’t already anticipate anyway. Also as far as I know, it’s not as if any phenomena currently not explainable were predicted by any form of theism.
I may be wrong on this though, as I am certainly not a theism expert. If so, this would be actual evidence for theism.
This is getting too complex given my tiredness. I have a feeling I’ve said something dumb along the way. I’ll be able to tell in the morning.
I don’t see why gods would be in every magical universe.