I am a fan of actual rehabilitation though, not of a punitive model for social influencing.
Paraphrasing:
if you have bad intentions, [nothing will ameliorate the effect on] your personal development.
Good word btw, ameliorateI, but to be clear, I don’t want to be fatalistic about this.
If “nothing” will ameliorate the development or maintenance of bad intention (just one aspect of personal development), it makes a case for increased use of the Death Penalty and “lock’em up and throw away the key” solutions on societies part which turn out to create more problems then they solve.
Mass incarceration is an obvious example of this.
If the AI has authority over you,
Then you’re not using the AI. It’s using you.
Potentially.
What it’s using you for becomes the concern then. Is it like a Good parent, encouraging real positive social development (whatever society views positive social development to be at the time)?
Or an abusive parent, punishing you into “behaving like a productive member of society” while causing undue and unhealthy stress?
Or like an ‘average parent’, making mistakes here and there, all the while continuing to update it’s own wisdom?
And not only is there the issue of authority, but also of responsibility. If it convinces you to do something that accidentally kills someone, which one of you goes to prison?
If it helps guide you into a relationship in which a child is conceived, what happens if you decide you don’t really want to be a parent?
I’ve seen arguments this is about probability of being caught determining people’s behavior and that magnitude of the punishment (or expected value) is otherwise ignored. If true, that’s awful and there is not a good reason for it.
Potentially.
What it’s using you for becomes the concern
Ah yes, using people, a sign of benevolence everywhere. /s
Is it like a Good parent, encouraging real positive social development (whatever society views positive social development to be at the time)?
I’ve seen arguments this is about probability of being caught determining people’s behavior and that magnitude of the punishment (or expected value) is otherwise ignored.
Isn’t this true of all laws, and social norms though? I think issues like Mass Incarceration are also about unequal application of the law across the entire population—“one law for me, another law for you” situations.
Potentially.
What it’s using you for becomes the concern
__________
Ah yes, using people, a sign of benevolence everywhere. /s
Sarcasm noted :).
The thing is, this concept of a sort of AI assisted ad hoc legal system OP wrote about will be using people. It will be using their input to negotiate and make decisions on the users behalf, because the legal landscape these AI and their users navigate would be an extension of existing law, and still depends on the notion of subsuming individual freedom to some extant, for the good of society.
The negotiation and cooperation of these AI only speed up the rate at which citizens in that world would be taking part in aspects of being governed—like tax collection—it doesn’t replace the reality of being governed.
Even if this system allows for the dissolving of political and physical boundaries in favor of defining ‘statehood’ in a virtual way for people of like minds, the entire system would be functioning like one big organism, and so it’s will would be revealed as time goes by.
As a side note, I think it seems reasonable to think of this tax collecting system as a twin of the stock market, and it’s behavior as possibly being as sporadic and dynamic. I wonder how these 2 systems would be integrated or insulated from one another. In the US, a line between public and private money is supposed to exist. How to maintain that division though?
Besides, All hail the mighty dollar, we all worship it, and hope for it’s benevolent administration of our quality of life. /s
Why would what society wants matter?
I guess that can depend on which society we’re talking about. although I think just asking the question assumes participation in said society, and so the motivation to make society matter to oneself in a positive way would necessitate consideration of what society wants. When society says one thing and does another though, it presents it’s citizens with more problems, not less.
It seems the entire system OP has written about is built around the idea of making it more difficult to put the individual users wants ahead of others. I think your comment about benevolence seems to say something positive about it’s value.
What if society wanted to be benevolent in this case, do you think it would look like OPs scenario?
That makes sense.
Paraphrasing:
if you have bad intentions, [nothing will ameliorate the effect on] your personal development.
If the AI has authority over you,
Then you’re not using the AI. It’s using you.
I am a fan of actual rehabilitation though, not of a punitive model for social influencing.
Good word btw, ameliorateI, but to be clear, I don’t want to be fatalistic about this.
If “nothing” will ameliorate the development or maintenance of bad intention (just one aspect of personal development), it makes a case for increased use of the Death Penalty and “lock’em up and throw away the key” solutions on societies part which turn out to create more problems then they solve.
Mass incarceration is an obvious example of this.
Potentially.
What it’s using you for becomes the concern then. Is it like a Good parent, encouraging real positive social development (whatever society views positive social development to be at the time)?
Or an abusive parent, punishing you into “behaving like a productive member of society” while causing undue and unhealthy stress?
Or like an ‘average parent’, making mistakes here and there, all the while continuing to update it’s own wisdom?
And not only is there the issue of authority, but also of responsibility. If it convinces you to do something that accidentally kills someone, which one of you goes to prison?
If it helps guide you into a relationship in which a child is conceived, what happens if you decide you don’t really want to be a parent?
I’ve seen arguments this is about probability of being caught determining people’s behavior and that magnitude of the punishment (or expected value) is otherwise ignored. If true, that’s awful and there is not a good reason for it.
Ah yes, using people, a sign of benevolence everywhere. /s
Why would what society wants matter?
Isn’t this true of all laws, and social norms though? I think issues like Mass Incarceration are also about unequal application of the law across the entire population—“one law for me, another law for you” situations.
__________
Sarcasm noted :).
The thing is, this concept of a sort of AI assisted ad hoc legal system OP wrote about will be using people. It will be using their input to negotiate and make decisions on the users behalf, because the legal landscape these AI and their users navigate would be an extension of existing law, and still depends on the notion of subsuming individual freedom to some extant, for the good of society.
The negotiation and cooperation of these AI only speed up the rate at which citizens in that world would be taking part in aspects of being governed—like tax collection—it doesn’t replace the reality of being governed.
Even if this system allows for the dissolving of political and physical boundaries in favor of defining ‘statehood’ in a virtual way for people of like minds, the entire system would be functioning like one big organism, and so it’s will would be revealed as time goes by.
As a side note, I think it seems reasonable to think of this tax collecting system as a twin of the stock market, and it’s behavior as possibly being as sporadic and dynamic. I wonder how these 2 systems would be integrated or insulated from one another. In the US, a line between public and private money is supposed to exist. How to maintain that division though?
Besides, All hail the mighty dollar, we all worship it, and hope for it’s benevolent administration of our quality of life. /s
I guess that can depend on which society we’re talking about. although I think just asking the question assumes participation in said society, and so the motivation to make society matter to oneself in a positive way would necessitate consideration of what society wants. When society says one thing and does another though, it presents it’s citizens with more problems, not less.
It seems the entire system OP has written about is built around the idea of making it more difficult to put the individual users wants ahead of others. I think your comment about benevolence seems to say something positive about it’s value.
What if society wanted to be benevolent in this case, do you think it would look like OPs scenario?