First of all guys i’m french so please forgive my language mistakes
I think we have to keep some spaces without rationality, Harry Potter is a novel created with a universe which is out of all our reality concepts, and this is made on purpose. Do we need to make it rational? This a great fanfiction but i think that if we want to find the rational, we have to make a difference between what is rationnal and what was made to not be rationnal :) to be understood clearly, I’m not blaming the fanfiction by itself, I’m just suprised that we try to make it rational, it’s a novel I don’t thinks it has to be coherent at each page, each line. Just to finish :When you’re looking for the coherence or th rational You’ll find it
Just for clarify, there’s no personal attacks in there, this is just for bring out a behavior We all have
The purpose of this fanfiction is not to force the Potterverse to make sense; it’s to use its popularity as a teaching tool. I don’t think anybody here has seriously complained that a fantasy setting was the chosen tool; the fact that magic doesn’t exist in the real world does not prevent enjoyment of the novels.
What I’m saying is the intent is laudable and that’s fine, I mean,if we try to make everything more rational,finally we wil no longer able to distinguish what is rational to what we made rational for me we have to leave room for irrational because it includes a large part of our world,this fanfiction is very well written but for me it should stay to the rank of fanfiction instead of object of study, after all maybe I don’t understand the true meaning of this one,in this case i apologize for my last comment, what do you think?
I mean,if we try to make everything more rational,finally we wil no longer able to distinguish what is rational to what we made rational for me we have to leave room for irrational because it includes a large part of our world
What exactly do you mean with the irrational that includes a large part of your world? Do you feel it’s threatened by Eliezer’s writing?
I mean irrational allow the dream,have you ever thought about the fact you could be professional singer or astronaut or even better another person or animal, Keep some irrational in or life is essential to describe us as human. And no i don’t feel it’s threatened by this novel, this novel’s great i think it’s the fact that we make it a studie’s object that CAN be threatening for the small part of irrationality we all still have. I’m not saying that for this behavior in particular, i’m saying that for all thoses kind of behavior like (just an exemple I read on another forum :) ) “The lord of the ring is a critics of the consumer society” , I think Lord of the ring is a beautiful story but I don’t think we have to see it with a rational point of view to enjoy it, that’s what I’m saying
I usually just lurk around these threads and never post anything, but I’m going to jump in here and say that, if I understand what you’re saying correctly (which I’m not sure I do, though I’ve read your posts in both english and french), I think you’re misunderstanding the purpose of HPMOR? It’s not a hate-fueled enterprise, and EY has said before that he’s not writing MOR to mock the Harry Potter series (I think in an author’s note he once said, and I’m paraphrasing here, that he completely understands the plot holes and irrationality that exist in HP as it’s a series of books for children, and he thinks that writing a novel for children is probably more difficult than writing a novel for adults). And I don’t think EY (or any rationalist, for that matter) is trying to stop people from having irrational dreams (or even holding some irrational beliefs); it is at its core about logic, and patterns of thinking, and seriously examining why you think the things you think and believe the things you believe.
And concerning your LOTR example (and I say this as someone not particularly invested in LOTR and I can’t comment on that interpretation), it is possible for a narrative to contain allegorical elements while still being a story, and it’s possible for readers to interpret meanings from a text that weren’t intended by an author, and the lack of authorial intent doesn’t mean that those meanings aren’t still a valid reading of the text. HPMOR is a teaching tool for rationality, but it’s also a story, and we’re still meant to enjoy it. Neither of those things threaten the other.
Given LessWrong ideals of rationality there nothing irrational about having a dream to be a professional singer provided the dream makes one happy and one’s goal is happiness.
PS: When speaking in a foreign language in which one isn’t very skilled, it’s useful to keep sentences short.
C’est ce que je dis, l’intention est louable et c’est très bien, je veux dire que à force rendre tout rationnel on ne saura plus distinguer ce qui est rationnel de ce que l’on a rendu rationnel, pour moi on devrai laisser de la place a l’irrationnel car il compose un grande partie de notre monde, la fanfiction est très bien écrite mais pour moi devrais rester au rang de fanfiction au lieu d’objet d’étude,après peut être n’ai je pas compris le vrai sens de cette dernière et dans ce cas je m’excuse pour ce commentaire, qu’est ce que tu en penses?
First of all guys i’m french so please forgive my language mistakes I think we have to keep some spaces without rationality, Harry Potter is a novel created with a universe which is out of all our reality concepts, and this is made on purpose. Do we need to make it rational? This a great fanfiction but i think that if we want to find the rational, we have to make a difference between what is rationnal and what was made to not be rationnal :) to be understood clearly, I’m not blaming the fanfiction by itself, I’m just suprised that we try to make it rational, it’s a novel I don’t thinks it has to be coherent at each page, each line. Just to finish :When you’re looking for the coherence or th rational You’ll find it Just for clarify, there’s no personal attacks in there, this is just for bring out a behavior We all have
The purpose of this fanfiction is not to force the Potterverse to make sense; it’s to use its popularity as a teaching tool. I don’t think anybody here has seriously complained that a fantasy setting was the chosen tool; the fact that magic doesn’t exist in the real world does not prevent enjoyment of the novels.
What I’m saying is the intent is laudable and that’s fine, I mean,if we try to make everything more rational,finally we wil no longer able to distinguish what is rational to what we made rational for me we have to leave room for irrational because it includes a large part of our world,this fanfiction is very well written but for me it should stay to the rank of fanfiction instead of object of study, after all maybe I don’t understand the true meaning of this one,in this case i apologize for my last comment, what do you think?
What exactly do you mean with the irrational that includes a large part of your world? Do you feel it’s threatened by Eliezer’s writing?
I mean irrational allow the dream,have you ever thought about the fact you could be professional singer or astronaut or even better another person or animal, Keep some irrational in or life is essential to describe us as human. And no i don’t feel it’s threatened by this novel, this novel’s great i think it’s the fact that we make it a studie’s object that CAN be threatening for the small part of irrationality we all still have. I’m not saying that for this behavior in particular, i’m saying that for all thoses kind of behavior like (just an exemple I read on another forum :) ) “The lord of the ring is a critics of the consumer society” , I think Lord of the ring is a beautiful story but I don’t think we have to see it with a rational point of view to enjoy it, that’s what I’m saying
I usually just lurk around these threads and never post anything, but I’m going to jump in here and say that, if I understand what you’re saying correctly (which I’m not sure I do, though I’ve read your posts in both english and french), I think you’re misunderstanding the purpose of HPMOR? It’s not a hate-fueled enterprise, and EY has said before that he’s not writing MOR to mock the Harry Potter series (I think in an author’s note he once said, and I’m paraphrasing here, that he completely understands the plot holes and irrationality that exist in HP as it’s a series of books for children, and he thinks that writing a novel for children is probably more difficult than writing a novel for adults). And I don’t think EY (or any rationalist, for that matter) is trying to stop people from having irrational dreams (or even holding some irrational beliefs); it is at its core about logic, and patterns of thinking, and seriously examining why you think the things you think and believe the things you believe.
And concerning your LOTR example (and I say this as someone not particularly invested in LOTR and I can’t comment on that interpretation), it is possible for a narrative to contain allegorical elements while still being a story, and it’s possible for readers to interpret meanings from a text that weren’t intended by an author, and the lack of authorial intent doesn’t mean that those meanings aren’t still a valid reading of the text. HPMOR is a teaching tool for rationality, but it’s also a story, and we’re still meant to enjoy it. Neither of those things threaten the other.
Given LessWrong ideals of rationality there nothing irrational about having a dream to be a professional singer provided the dream makes one happy and one’s goal is happiness.
PS: When speaking in a foreign language in which one isn’t very skilled, it’s useful to keep sentences short.
Comme le titre l’indique, ce roman cherche à être rationnel.
C’est ce que je dis, l’intention est louable et c’est très bien, je veux dire que à force rendre tout rationnel on ne saura plus distinguer ce qui est rationnel de ce que l’on a rendu rationnel, pour moi on devrai laisser de la place a l’irrationnel car il compose un grande partie de notre monde, la fanfiction est très bien écrite mais pour moi devrais rester au rang de fanfiction au lieu d’objet d’étude,après peut être n’ai je pas compris le vrai sens de cette dernière et dans ce cas je m’excuse pour ce commentaire, qu’est ce que tu en penses?